Jason "All" Day
- Thread starter Kevin Shields
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Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
Do you feel better now?
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
For the record, I think it's obvious I vigorously defend Tour players against choke accusers and swing analyzers. So give me my one vent here. Geez. I think he's slow, I didn't say he was a rapist or anything. Seems like a great guy.
Burner
New
No! I feel bad about having disturbed your delicate sensibilities but don't let that worry you, I''ll get over it.
Have a good Thanksgiving.
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
It takes a lot to disturb my delicate sensibilities and you took a cheap shot at me.
wow, thats a little harsh dont you think? I dunno I like to watch him swing so I dont think I pay much attentionand he shows some emotion too, but JB Holmes I want to kill the man watching him play my god its torture!
magicmarker
New
Day doesn't bother me as much as Furyk and Holmes. At least Day will take his time and then execute the shot, Furyk drives everyone nuts because everyone, in the crowd, in the foursome, in the tv audience, is thinking this is it, it's finally going to happen and then he backs out of it again. Holmes, a guy who is usually last to hit his approach in to the green, is never ready for it. Holmes plays slow to his own detriment IMO, Day plays better slow IMO and Furyk just gets off on driving everyone crazy and never hitting a shot on truly LIVE tv because the producers know his style.
Dariusz J.
New member
Actually, I think the discussion who's fast and who's slow is silly. They do not break any rules and one should have deep in the ass what TV viewers think. Media already spoiled this great game and narrowed it to a short game contest.
Cheers
Cheers
dschultz6072
New
Big cheap shot. Not cool
Burner
New
tbone1065, dschultz6072 & Kevin,
Hardly a cheap shot when it was addressed directly to Kevin and giving him leave to reply.
Jason Day, for whom I have no particular affinity, did not enjoy such privilege.
Kevin dishes it often enough and should be able accept a little fall out when the wind changes direction.
Hardly a cheap shot when it was addressed directly to Kevin and giving him leave to reply.
Jason Day, for whom I have no particular affinity, did not enjoy such privilege.
Kevin dishes it often enough and should be able accept a little fall out when the wind changes direction.
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
Actually Dariusz, there is a breach of rules. They have a set amount of time to execute their shots and some break that every time but the Tour does nothing. 5 hours to play twosomes in stroke play with no looking for balls?
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Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
Curious to know when I've dished it to you? It was a cheap shot all the way to let me know I'm on the couch and not on tour.....which I've said myself dozens of times. That's why I defend the top players full tilt. But like I said, if it makes you feel like a big man, great. I can handle it.
Dariusz J.
New member
Correct me if I am wrong, but there is no rule concering the overall time of play. There are rules concerning the time of executing a shot while there are no rules what is max time spent over a putt or on the green.
Cheers
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
I'm actually not sure what the difference is? A shot is a shot. Are you asking if there's different time limits on shots from off the green?
I played with Jason in the last year before he turned pro. He was very meticulous and took detailed stats for each shot as well as having a lot of technical thoughts he was working on with pre swing drills etc. If I could have two seconds in a major at his age I'd do whatever it took. If it was in my nature to fiddle around a bit I'd do it until someone told me I'd crossed the line. It's an individual sport afterall, you gotta do what you've gotta do. As for that leg twitch thing, I was at the Aus Open last week and he said he didn't even know he did it. It's just like tennis players adjusting their shirt or their cap or their strings the same time every time purely out of habit. I had a mate that used to adjust his package just before shots when nervous in tournaments. He didn't realise he did it. I kinda believe him because it was pretty weird with people watching.
PGA Tour Rules on "Slow Play" (at least as I remember them back when I played the Senior Tour in the 90's:
SP is defined as being both "Out of Position" and "Over Time". You must be both in order to be "put on the clock" so to speak.
Yes there is an overall time (broken down to each hole by dividing by 18 with adjustments for par 3 vs par 5). Overall time can vary from course to course depending upon geography (long walks from green to tee, etc.).
OP basically means that on a par 4, you must reach the tee before the group in front clears the green. Slightly different definitions for par 3 & par 5. You can be "OP" but if you are not OT, you are not subject to being put on the clock. Same if you are OT but still in position - no on the clock.
If you are "on the clock" you are given 30 seconds once it is "clearly" your turn to play. Applies to putts, chips, whatever. The first player to hit has an additional 10 seconds (40 total). Delays for rulings, spectator control, etc do not count. If you fall OP because of rulings, etc. you are given a certain # of holes to "catch up" to position.
Obviously, these rules are not strictly enforced.
Regarding someone like Furyk - as long as his group remains in position, he can take as much time as he wants to go through his putting routine.
This is provided as general info based upon what I remember from playing in Tour Events (both Senior & Regular). The current rules have most likely been modified so don't hold me to this being completely correct - but should give you the idea. Rules for events outside of PGA Tour (US Open, PGA Cham, Masters, etc) may vary.
Bruce
SP is defined as being both "Out of Position" and "Over Time". You must be both in order to be "put on the clock" so to speak.
Yes there is an overall time (broken down to each hole by dividing by 18 with adjustments for par 3 vs par 5). Overall time can vary from course to course depending upon geography (long walks from green to tee, etc.).
OP basically means that on a par 4, you must reach the tee before the group in front clears the green. Slightly different definitions for par 3 & par 5. You can be "OP" but if you are not OT, you are not subject to being put on the clock. Same if you are OT but still in position - no on the clock.
If you are "on the clock" you are given 30 seconds once it is "clearly" your turn to play. Applies to putts, chips, whatever. The first player to hit has an additional 10 seconds (40 total). Delays for rulings, spectator control, etc do not count. If you fall OP because of rulings, etc. you are given a certain # of holes to "catch up" to position.
Obviously, these rules are not strictly enforced.
Regarding someone like Furyk - as long as his group remains in position, he can take as much time as he wants to go through his putting routine.
This is provided as general info based upon what I remember from playing in Tour Events (both Senior & Regular). The current rules have most likely been modified so don't hold me to this being completely correct - but should give you the idea. Rules for events outside of PGA Tour (US Open, PGA Cham, Masters, etc) may vary.
Bruce
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
Did he ulna deviate or use use flexing and extension when adjusting his package? Never mind. I regret starting this thread obviously. It was a knee jerk reaction to watching several shots in a row where there was just a ton of fiddling around. In retrospect, there seems to be other players ( Furyk comes to mind) that are just as slow. Anyway, I rarely feel bad for Tour players because, as Burner was so nice to point out, I'm at home and they're on TV. But I did feel bad for him to hit the shots he did in his home country in singles.
Steve Greffen
New
Kevin, the general premise of the thread was in good intention, in that slow play is an epidemic in golf from the local club all the way to the tour. You saw Day taking extra time and commented. The shots you saw probably were painfully slow, I saw some over the coverage that were slow and some that seemed fairly normal. Overall though you are right that 5 hours for this type of match is too high.
In light of Bruce's comments, I agree that these are probably similar to the current rules on pace of play (Dariuz got one wrong!). The problem is on the enforcement of the rules. Most of the time the players are not getting out of positon because the groups in front of them are slow as well. Their collective times are over the presribed times but there are no penalties. It would be interesting to see an event uphold a 4 hour pace and stick to it for all the groups. How would everyone react, how would it be to watch? Players would be more reacitve I would think, and scores probably really similar.
In light of Bruce's comments, I agree that these are probably similar to the current rules on pace of play (Dariuz got one wrong!). The problem is on the enforcement of the rules. Most of the time the players are not getting out of positon because the groups in front of them are slow as well. Their collective times are over the presribed times but there are no penalties. It would be interesting to see an event uphold a 4 hour pace and stick to it for all the groups. How would everyone react, how would it be to watch? Players would be more reacitve I would think, and scores probably really similar.
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