Putting Rant

[niblick1]

you could end up like my dad... 60 years old, playing for 44 years, and he still cant putt.... just saying...

hey, you know, when I was 5 years old, my dad his friend, and my uncle all picked this really odd place to putt from, everyone tried and no one could get it closer than 5 or 6 feet, I asked if I could try, they laughed and said sure... I knew what to do, there was no doubt in my mind where that ball needed to go in order to get it to the hole, no doubt how hard I needed to hit it. I ended up putting that ball 90 degrees away from the hole, 30 feet up a hill and it fell back toward the hole, to about 3 inches short of the hole. 5 years old.... I have no clue how to putt anymore.... but I remember that as clear as can be, my dad tells the story to EVERYONE we play with.
All I know is, putting is 10 percent mechanics, and 90 percent intuition.... I just muttled up that intuition by replacing it with mechanics over the years.
Trying to perfect an already pretty damn good intuition is death to the putting stroke, and I bet thats what you did when you were younger. Now you are suffering for it.
I feel you, I only hope now that I have come to that realization that I can get some of that putting intuition back.

I agree. The robotic shoulder stroke was the feel-killer for me. Got to get some feel back first.

 

[dashfan87]

I agree. The robotic shoulder stroke was the feel-killer for me. Got to get some feel back first.

When I was five, do you think I cared if the putter came back on an arch, strait through, the end come up to my belly, or if my left hand was low? heck no... all i knew was, if I put the ball here, it should fall back towards the hole. and thats what I did... I have gotten so concerned with the club and what its supposed to do, I cant FEEL a damn putt for anything.

 

[birdie_man]

"Not caring" or even "carefree".....................I tried to apply it to more than just putting but putting or not this concept has always been iffy for me. You know you do care. To me, I'm still unsure if you can try too hard but I know you can try the wrong things.

"The secret of putting is domination of the nerves." -Henry Cotton

With what you know Otto I would think you must have a decent enough stroke. (though y'all know I am a mechanics guy too)

Root cause is...?

???

You need something that holds up off the putting green. Know what does and what doesn't. For example: practicing, I can often do pretty well with just aiming while over the ball and hiting it. I haven't been able to take that to the course.

A lot of people swing too far to the right in putting. (and full swing for that matter) Try something NHAish for putting, if you catch my drift. (though you can swing too far left also)

I always try to approach everything I do in preshot very patiently....also keep in mind though I mostly am not a very urgent person in nature. Can't hurt to try though and surely everyone has some patience in them.

I didn't putt better when I was younger, even though I had lower standards, less pressure, and knew less.

For the short putts it helps me to know I am aimed well when I am over the ball. When I am second guessing it is line-related.

On long putts my distance control is usually fine if my mind is out of it. (assuming I've read the uphill/downhill of the putt correctly)

If you can putt well on practice greens and when you are calm and on auto then obviously some changes that a round of golf bring are affecting that. It may be pressure or something you are doing differently without knowing it.

Putting problems are no fun.

You've got mail. (coming up)............(probably tomorrow)

 

[Juan47]

Otto... Here are a couple of ideas for improving your putting that may help.

Mental Approach: Try using Affirmations. I have several I write down three times a day, or read out loud three times a day to help me develop a positive putting approach. Rotella writes about this in his latest book, "Your 15th Club." I learned it from a guy who runs an intense golf school which prepares college and touring pros. If you tell yourself. " I am a PGA Tour Quality Putter" or "I am an excellent putter" over and over you begin to believe in yourself, and get better. On the other hand, if you continually tell yourself "I suck" guess what you will.

Statistical Approach to Improvement. About 2 years ago, I started tracking, not just the number of putts per round, but, more importantly, the length of my first putt and how many putts it took to get in the hole from that distance. I tracked the distances using the stats from the PGA Tour which is collected by Shotlink. This to me was a better measure of my putting skills/performance than number of putts, since number of putts are impacted by a LOT of other factors like # of greens hit, how well you chip or come out of bunkers, how much you miss the green by, etc. But putting performance from a certain distance is purer.

For example: Below is the percentage of one putts for various distances from the hole as collected by Shotlink on the PGA Tour for 2004

Inside 3 feet 99.1%
3-4 feet 90.9%
4-5 feet 80.8%
5-6 feet 69.8%
6-7 feet 61.6%
7-8 feet 54%
8-9 feet 47%
9-10 feet 42.2%
10-15 feet 31%
15-20 feet 18.9%
20-25 feet 13.2%
Over 25 feet 5.8%

By collecting data I could see that I had difficulty in the 10-15 foot range, so I worked like heck on that distance... and of course got better.

I also found out that I three putted 23% of the time if my first putt was more than 35 feet from the hole. Well I had two choices if I wanted to get rid of this problem. I could hit my approach shots closer (yeah!!) and/or work on putts greater than 35 feet to improve my distance control.

Like you I have worked a lot on my putting over the three plus years I have played golf. I know I am a very good putter. My stats tell me so, and I have played well in putting tournaments. Last year finishing 3rd out of 271 players in a large putting tournament in Florida. Good luck on getting better... "like the little engine that could....I think, I can..."

BTW, I have worked with Mike Shannon on my putting stroke, and do not find I have distance control issues with long putts. Maybe it is me.

 

[PChandler]

Welcome to Manzellaland

Juan

Nice to see you posting here.

PChandler

 

[thefuture37]

Mental Approach: Try using Affirmations. I have several I write down three times a day, or read out loud three times a day to help me develop a positive putting approach. Rotella writes about this in his latest book, "Your 15th Club." I learned it from a guy who runs an intense golf school which prepares college and touring pros. If you tell yourself. " I am a PGA Tour Quality Putter" or "I am an excellent putter" over and over you begin to believe in yourself, and get better. On the other hand, if you continually tell yourself "I suck" guess what you will.

how about "I'm good enough, I'm smart enough, and gosh darn it, people like me!"

 

[mjstrong]

how about "I'm good enough, I'm smart enough, and gosh darn it, people like me!"

I haven't yet seen Stuart Smalley on the PGA Tour...

 

[thefuture37]

I haven't yet seen Stuart Smalley on the PGA Tour...

yeah i dont buy the affirmation idea. it only works if you are actually a good putter, but dont realize it. if you suck, you can butter yourself up all day long, but you will still suck.

 

[Steve Greffen]

yeah i dont buy the affirmation idea. it only works if you are actually a good putter, but dont realize it. if you suck, you can butter yourself up all day long, but you will still suck.

And if you stick with that you will always suck!! Even if you improve your skill, so you have to have a lot less negative.

(Maybe not possible for you Future?? kinda negative?)

 

[curtisj76]

And if you stick with that you will always suck!! Even if you improve your skill, so you have to have a lot less negative.

(Maybe not possible for you Future?? kinda negative?)

I agree, I think a golfer would suck less than they normally suck if you they thought differently. Do I think it's going to knock off 25% of your putts? No, but it certainly doesn't hurt. The mind is very powerful, as we all know.

 

[Steve Greffen]

I agree, I think a golfer would suck less than they normally suck if you they thought differently. Do I think it's going to knock off 25% of your putts? No, but it certainly doesn't hurt. The mind is very powerful, as we all know.

And the point of getting better too Curtis. How are you going to strive to improve when you have a bad opinion of your putting? I posted about his already on this thread and I think that a more positive approach on your day to day putting (I have heard bad putters say they got lucky one round if they happened to putt well one round, foolish) and a systematic approach to one pattern to improve would go a long way for many "poor putters".

 

[thefuture37]

if you suck at putting, and you tell yourself you suck at putting, thats not a "bad" opinion of your putting. that REALISTIC. that should clue you in to try to get better at putting, rather than just telling yourself you are somehow better at putting than before just because you say so.

 

[Steve Greffen]

if you suck at putting, and you tell yourself you suck at putting, thats not a "bad" opinion of your putting. that REALISTIC. that should clue you in to try to get better at putting, rather than just telling yourself you are somehow better at putting than before just because you say so.

I knew you wouldn't get the positive approach! Hey I am 100 percent positive that this is a hurdle for some. I have seen it! Especially when it comes to trying to improve because that is when they just can't seem I do anything right. In spite of themselves.

Don't be so hard on yourself!

 

[thefuture37]

I knew you wouldn't get the positive approach! Hey I am 100 percent positive that this is a hurdle for some. I have seen it! Especially when it comes to trying to improve because that is when they just can't seem I do anything right. In spite of themselves.

Don't be so hard on yourself!

i would rather be a bad putter and not be delusional than the other way around. sanity is more important than golf.

 

[curtisj76]

Just like anything in life, confidence helps. If you go into an interview thinking, "I'm not going to get this job", guess what happens. Yeah, you don't get the job. Even pro's think they can make 60 ft putts, even when there's a slight chance. For myself, I'm good at chipping. When I step up to a chip, my mind is thinking "MAKE IT". It doesn't surprise me that the two of us disagree on this.

 

[curtisj76]

"All great putters believe they are great putters. Average putters defeat themselves because they see themselves as bad putters. They remember only the putts they missed, never the ones they made. Great putters not only believe they are good putters but also love the process of making putts. They truly believe they can make every putt. You might not have the stroke of a great putter, but you can think like one."

 

[Steve Greffen]

I don't know....what do you think Curtis? Is future delusional? He certainly seems to be missing our point. I like how you say "confidence" Curtis. That's a good description. Of course future probably thinks he can be negatively confident. Or maybe he just sucks at confidence!!

No offence future just banter. Don't want you getting a complex!

 

[thefuture37]

Of course future probably thinks he can be negatively confident.

that doesnt make sense. much like rotella's thinking that all you need to do is tell yourself you are a good putter to become a better putter.

trevino had a good quote in response to somebody asking him what his "mental" game was. he said he didnt have one. he got confidence from being well prepared, he said. he said he knew if he put in the work, it would pay off.

and if rotella was a golf psych back in trevino's day, he would be out of a job!

another funny note about rotella's 15th club book. the big story in that book is about how mental tough harrington became after working with rotella and how that helped him win his first open championship. remember that was the open where he almost van de velde'd it right to sergio by hitting it in the drink TWICE on the 72nd hole. good example for your book rotella!!!

 

[Steve Greffen]

that doesnt make sense. much like rotella's thinking that all you need to do is tell yourself you are a good putter to become a better putter.

trevino had a good quote in response to somebody asking him what his "mental" game was. he said he didnt have one. he got confidence from being well prepared, he said. he said he knew if he put in the work, it would pay off.

and if rotella was a golf psych back in trevino's day, he would be out of a job!

another funny note about rotella's 15th club book. the big story in that book is about how mental tough harrington became after working with rotella and how that helped him win his first open championship. remember that was the open where he almost van de velde'd it right to sergio by hitting it in the drink TWICE on the 72nd hole. good example for your book rotella!!!

That's not what either of us are saying. You don't become a great putter by "just" thinking that you are great or saying your great. You do need to prepare and work on it but man you are missing the point that self confidence helps. I don't give a crap on Rotella, I may have read one book a long time ago. To me this is just common sense. I'm telling you I have seen guys not live up to their potential for being negative.

 

[Damon Lucas]

I actually lean towards future on this one...

If you suck, telling yourself that you're great does not all of a sudden make you great. It puts kind of a 'house of cards' type confidence around you.

I prefer the type of confidence where you know that you can do something.

For this you need proof, or good feedback, away from the competitive environment that demonstrates your abilities in the 'nervous' area. Then you just go and reproduce game time.

Harrington is one of the great practisers. Rotella probably is helpful in slaying some of the negatives that go through this type of personality, but I would be inclined to credit the Trevino-esque preparation before Rotella's input.