Sequenced release

[curtisj76]

Need a little clarification please. I just watched Building Blocks where Brian mentions and demonstrates a sequenced release. Immediately, a light bulb came on and then I searched for a post I read and found it:

"Someone, somewhere taught the poor golfer to PURPOSELY UNCOCK THE WRISTS before the clubface started turning off the plane. The dreaded "Sequenced Release" that may be the worse idea I ever tested in my teaching in my whole life."

So have we tossed the "sequenced release" in the junk pile? If so, what has it been replaced with? Thanks

 

[Jared Willerson]

Been scrapped. Personally, I think sequenced release leads to throwaway.

 

[pecky987]

i think you are mistaken glcoach. i think the majority of golfers have a sequenced release.

what brian dislikes so much is people being taught to purposely uncock their left wrist i.e. using positive torque to uncock the left wrist as opposed to using outward forces created in the swing to cause the uncocking.

i would say most players uncock before they unroll. in building blocks brian says how you should learn what the trow-out action causing the uncocking feels like, not that you should purposely uncock your left wrist

 

[bamfur]

i think u should cock more on the downswing as your hips pull ur arms/hand down, the uncocking comes much later a little before impact...

 

[Brian Manzella]

I'll be doing a new improved "non-beta" version of Building Blocks soon.

Of course, since someone else STOLE my Building Blocks title idea, I will probably call it:

Step-by-Step

Then, someone will steal that too.

Oh, it will not have ANY reference to—or demonstration of—Sequenced release, which I have come to despise.

 

[Deadly_Scope]

Sequenced release is a theoretical concept invented by Homer Kelley based as the consequential result of the entire golfers flail as depicted in 2-K being longitudinally accelerated on an inclined plane.

Unfortunately the model isn't accurate. I could go into why, but no one would understand anyways so its not really worth my time...

 

[Kevin Shields]

Why dont you give it a shot. We might not be as dumb as you think.

 

[fronesis]

Indeed, a lot of folks around here have repeatedly proven themselves to be really smart. One of the first rules for any teacher is "don't underestimate your students," so why not assume we are all decent students and give us the explanation?

 

[Damon Lucas]

Sequenced release is a theoretical concept invented by Homer Kelley based as the consequential result of the entire golfers flail as depicted in 2-K being longitudinally accelerated on an inclined plane.

Unfortunately the model isn't accurate. I could go into why, but no one would understand anyways so its not really worth my time...

I think a lot of people around here are interested in your thoughts, Matthew.
Seems like your studies went away from TGM about 2-3 years ago. Interested as to what you found.

 

[curtisj76]

I could go into why, but no one would understand anyways so its not really worth my time...

I find it amusing how almost ever single post you make is followed by something like the above.

 

[Jared Willerson]

i think you are mistaken glcoach. i think the majority of golfers have a sequenced release.

what brian dislikes so much is people being taught to purposely uncock their left wrist i.e. using positive torque to uncock the left wrist as opposed to using outward forces created in the swing to cause the uncocking.

i would say most players uncock before they unroll. in building blocks brian says how you should learn what the trow-out action causing the uncocking feels like, not that you should purposely uncock your left wrist

That is the point....consciously uncocking the wrist leads to throwaway IMO, should have been more clear. Plus the "sequenced release" devalues the role of the pivot, also JMO.

 

[curtisj76]

So here's the question: What is replacing "sequenced release"?

 

[vjsinger]

No "replacement"...just garbage.

 

[curtisj76]

Something has to replace it. If you used to do something called "X" and now you don't, you have to do "Y" or something. Brian will do "Y" with his new and improved BB. The whole reason I started this thread was that I wanted to learn what the proper hand action through the ball was. I'm trying to find what "Y" is since "X" is out. If it's the toss I'm in trouble because I don't like it.

 

[Deadly_Scope]

The concept of sequence release is based on the golfers flail of 2-K moving longitudinally on a flat plane. This model would indeed create a sequenced release whereby the uncocking motion of this construct would take place prior to the point that the primary lever assembly is inline at which time the roll action could take place without causing the club to be offplane. The model does produce a sequenced release however it is inaccurate to the way that the human model operates.

The golfers flail as depicted 2-K allows the motion of the club relative to the left arm on two planes (cock/uncock and turn/roll). Hence, the flat left wrist concept which maintains this constant relationship with the left wristcock always staying on a plane with the left arm. Unfortunately, for Homer Kelley the left arm is above plane during the golf stroke which means that the uncocking motion with the flat left wrist concept would never be aligned to the inclined plane.

Now this can be reconciled with an offset where in the turned state, the bend of the left wrist occurs to the degree that the left arm goes into the plane in order to align the wristcock plane to the inclined plane.

The inline condition with the left arm above the plane is taken by using a vertical plane to the inclined plane through the left arm and impact is reached prior to this event in all good golf strokes. Obviously thats yet another huge contradiction in the book because if the roll was somehow automatic as Homer Kelley thought after the wristcock had 'run out' per the model, you would be past the point desired for impact. Even if this was possible the roll into impact would occur with such a burst in speed that the clubface control would be erratic.

So in summary, the release can be sequenced but certainly not the way Homer Kelley described it.

I wrote this very fast - so any typos, gramatical mistakes...etc or if its just too complex (and I did try to only cover the simple stuff that people might get)... I just don't care ...

 

[Kevin Shields]

I never dreamed someone could be so arrogant. You must be a barrel a laughs (or 4 barrels) to hang out with. You should start your own forum where only people as smart as you can read your stuff.

What is it that makes you think that no one can understand anything? Did you invent the golf swing?

 

[Brian Manzella]

Arrogance doesn't bother me....

The concept of sequence release is based on the golfers flail of 2-K moving longitudinally on a flat plane. This model would indeed create a sequenced release whereby the uncocking motion of this construct would take place prior to the point that the primary lever assembly is inline at which time the roll action could take place without causing the club to be offplane. The model does produce a sequenced release however it is inaccurate to the way that the human model operates.

The golfers flail as depicted 2-K allows the motion of the club relative to the left arm on two planes (cock/uncock and turn/roll). Hence, the flat left wrist concept which maintains this constant relationship with the left wristcock always staying on a plane with the left arm. Unfortunately, for Homer Kelley the left arm is above plane during the golf stroke which means that the uncocking motion with the flat left wrist concept would never be aligned to the inclined plane.

Now this can be reconciled with an offset where in the turned state, the bend of the left wrist occurs to the degree that the left arm goes into the plane in order to align the wristcock plane to the inclined plane.

The inline condition with the left arm above the plane is taken by using a vertical plane to the inclined plane through the left arm and impact is reached prior to this event in all good golf strokes. Obviously thats yet another huge contradiction in the book because if the roll was somehow automatic as Homer Kelley thought after the wristcock had 'run out' per the model, you would be past the point desired for impact. Even if this was possible the roll into impact would occur with such a burst in speed that the clubface control would be erratic.

So in summary, the release can be sequenced but certainly not the way Homer Kelley described it.

I wrote this very fast - so any typos, gramatical mistakes...etc or if its just too complex (and I did try to only cover the simple stuff that people might get)... I just don't care ...

Matthew,

This is brilliant stuff.

Do you feel like this is the reason that Hogan and Garcia both ADDED left wrist bend—from their top-of-the-backswing left wrist condition—and then took the bend out pre-impact?

 

[savydan]

My guess is that Hogan added the cup in the left wrist at the top so the shaft and left arm were out of plane with each other so he was in a low-leverage position. He could go hard from the top without over springing the shaft. The thought being it is better to spring the shaft (and go from cupped to bowed) after the free ride. Not at the top, and not during impact, but more in the middle of the downswing like page 98-99, his downswing sequence of five lessons.

 

[curtisj76]

I never dreamed someone could be so arrogant. You must be a barrel a laughs (or 4 barrels) to hang out with. You should start your own forum where only people as smart as you can read your stuff.

What is it that makes you think that no one can understand anything? Did you invent the golf swing?

It's how you get kicked out of other golf forums. But it does seem like he knows the techno stuff.

 

[fronesis]

It's how you get kicked out of other golf forums. But it does seem like he knows the techno stuff.

I don't mind the technical stuff at all, even if it's technical TGM stuff that is new to me. If it helps to explain or demonstrate an important point, then be as technical as you need to be.

But the attitude is just overwhelming. The idea that deadly_scope not only knows more than everyone else here, but also that we are not intelligent enough to ever understand what it is that he knows - I personally find that tone really repellent. His posts repeatedly suggest that he is more concerned to look or sound intelligent than he is to make points about the golf swing. His posts seem intentionally constructed so as to obfuscate his point, to make it harder for folks to follow him.

That's why I completely agree with Kevin when he notes his shock at Deadly_Scope's arrogance.

I would also add that such arrogance seems misplaced. A REALLY smart person (e.g. Brian) can make incisive and important points AND explain them in such a way that a large portion of reasonably-literate people can understand them. And Brian never tries to make something seem more complex than it is.

Deadly_Scope will, no doubt, now attack me for having written this, and probably will explain again to everyone how stupid I am and how smart he is.