The Game has changed forever

[siksta]

Here's my agrument guys as witnessed by last weeks tournament. Bubba Watson was -16 on the par 5's so in reality he was even par on the 3's and par 4's hardly a cry for pure ball striking! The days of shotmaking are long gone due to equipment and the golf ball. But lets face it TV loves it, you love it, kids love it and $ 500 drivers will sell forever.Back to Bubba one of the longest drivers and irons players i think hits wedges over 160yds but is close to dead last from 125yds in? So what do we teach are youngsters today. Hit the ball as far as you can? Forget accuracy? A young man today dosent have a chance if he dosent hit it far unless its the US Open where the rough is a measely 4in high. The game has changed forever! It is what it is.
Onlythe USGA, PGA members, etc etc can protest and protect and put the game back to to levels before why so TECHNOLOGY DOES NOT BECOME MORE IMPORTANT THAN ABILITY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
On a funny note the great John Madden football coach and analyst said in one telecast if you enjoy wayching football then watch it but football will never be the same as it was in the 60's and 70's where they had unprotected hard hits.players played offense and defense, there was no oxygen after a player ran 100yds etc etc
So now the state of Golf is offsets, upright clubs, lightweight, sweetspots a 5yr old cant miss with, every way to make a player better instead of teaching him how to strike a golf ball.
Bubba will probably win a few more in his career kinda hard not to when your longest club in is a 7 iron to any green but he wont go done in history as a great ball striker no way no way talented yes. I'll take Corey Pavi from 200 yds behind a tree everyday of the week. Bar none.
So enjoy the state of golf i love to watch it just like everyone else but its a different game.

 

[golfdad]

Here's my agrument guys as witnessed by last weeks tournament. Bubba Watson was -16 on the par 5's so in reality he was even par on the 3's and par 4's hardly a cry for pure ball striking! The days of shotmaking are long gone due to equipment and the golf ball. But lets face it TV loves it, you love it, kids love it and $ 500 drivers will sell forever.Back to Bubba one of the longest drivers and irons players i think hits wedges over 160yds but is close to dead last from 125yds in? So what do we teach are youngsters today. Hit the ball as far as you can? Forget accuracy? A young man today dosent have a chance if he dosent hit it far unless its the US Open where the rough is a measely 4in high. The game has changed forever! It is what it is.
Onlythe USGA, PGA members, etc etc can protest and protect and put the game back to to levels before why so TECHNOLOGY DOES NOT BECOME MORE IMPORTANT THAN ABILITY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
On a funny note the great John Madden football coach and analyst said in one telecast if you enjoy wayching football then watch it but football will never be the same as it was in the 60's and 70's where they had unprotected hard hits.players played offense and defense, there was no oxygen after a player ran 100yds etc etc
So now the state of Golf is offsets, upright clubs, lightweight, sweetspots a 5yr old cant miss with, every way to make a player better instead of teaching him how to strike a golf ball.
Bubba will probably win a few more in his career kinda hard not to when your longest club in is a 7 iron to any green but he wont go done in history as a great ball striker no way no way talented yes. I'll take Corey Pavi from 200 yds behind a tree everyday of the week. Bar none.
So enjoy the state of golf i love to watch it just like everyone else but its a different game.

i think you have made a lot of good points, but one thing bubba did also quite well was putting. without solid putting, he could not turn his long game into real advantage. he made quite a few putts that usually require 2 putts by most people. even his competitors. so, at the end of the day,,we cannot overlook the importance of putting, which i think will not change with time.

so a lady went up to a famous violinist after the concert and said,,,your violin sounded fabulous. the violinist picked up the violin and put it next to his ear and said to the lady: funny,,i cannot hear a thing.

 

[GPM1985]

So enjoy the state of golf i love to watch it just like everyone else but its a different game.

Yes, games change with time. However, the sob sister traditionalist argument that the modern game requires less skill is totally bogus. Bubba is a very talented ball striker. Did you not see him splitting fairways at 320-plus yards? How about his putting? Was the up-and-down he made from nowhere on 18 skillful?

What about Phil? He almost hooped a wedge on 18 after a stuffed wedge on 17, which followed a center-cut 325-yard bomb. No skill though, right?

 

[Bigwill]

If you were speaking about one of the other bomber's, then I could see the point of your post. But every pro who sees Bubba play has marvels at his shotmaking! If anything, Bubba is a throwback, Corey Pavin on steroids.

That aside, the modern equipment being more forgiving does lend itself to younger players swinging more aggressively. Nick Price has spoken to this. And because the equipment lends itself to straighter shots, you don't have to worry about moving it as much. But I don't know if that should be an indictment on equipment.

Skill is relative anyway. You're competing against your contemporaries. Everyone has the same equipment, so you still have to be better than just about everyone else. And with better equipment, doesn't that take equipment out of the equation as a variable that needs to be accounted for?

Sure, the game has changed, but I personally don't think it's a bad thing.

I do agree with Madden, though

 

[Bell812]

I was thinking along the same lines Bigwill. Bubba kinda blends old and new. He is for sure a bomber, but he works the ball as much as anybody out there. If you ever get a chance to watch him on the range at an event, it's worth the price of admission.

 

[counterfall]

If the equipment was such a factor, then wouldn't there be a lot less mishit shots? That doesn't seem to be the case in the tournaments I watch. I see Tiger and Phil, etc. miss fairways as bad as I do. Sure the equipment allows everyone to hit it further off of the tee and slightly off of the sweet spot with the irons but the short game still has to be accurate to score. And the pros are still scary skilled just like they have always been.

Now when it comes to hybrids, you could definitely say that they allow people to be less skilled in the ball striking department and still compete with those who are clearly more skilled. My grandfather (+1 HC at 70) was able to hit a 2 iron rather well and I haven't used one in...ever. But I bet if he were still alive, he would say that he would be forced to use one so that someone else did not have a competitive edge.

The bottom line though is that everyone still has to sink putts to win. And you have to take advantage of your strengths. Bubba can bomb it so he takes advantage of the par 5s the most. I would take my 67 that way if I could.

 

[softconsult]

Well, the original post was quite a mouthful!

So Sitska, if you wouldn't mind, please explain why upright lies are
so beneficial for today's golfers.

 

[Virtuoso]

Yes, the game has changed: being successful on tour is a lot harder.

Am I sad that a guy can't win on tour if he averages 252 yds off the tee, even if he can hit a little knockdown fade with his 7-wood? No.

 

[birly-shirly]

Not sure I agree with the OP. A long hitter winning a tournament on the par-5s doesn't make for a revolution in the game. And Bubba's not a dominant player (yet), although as a few people have pointed out, he might be very entertaining to watch.

Tiger, on the other hand, has been as dominant over a 10 year stretch as anyone, ever. And he did it with blades and a ball/driver combo that was definitely not optimised for distance.

So far as the statement "So now the state of Golf is offsets, upright clubs, lightweight, sweetspots a 5yr old cant miss with" goes - I'm not convinced that any of these design factors yield much benefit for a good player, nevermind a touring pro.

 

[mgranato]

Where is the Ball Striker's Hall of Fame? Doesntmatterville?

Golf is still about score - period. For all his gaudy length, Bubba's win still rested on a difficult bunker shot and a wicked downhill breaking putt.

The most famous picture of the most famous ball striker (Hogan's 1 iron) was a missed green. Can you find a way (anyway) to get it in the hole? That's pure golf.

 

[Richie3Jack]

My feeling is power/length in golf should be rewarded....to a degree

And accuracy and precision should be rewarded....to a degree.

I don't even ask that every golf shot be punished for going in the rough. I think if you hit it 375 yards and are in the first cut of rough, you should be in great shape. Even if you're barely in the 2nd cut of rough, you should have a shot that will be difficult to stop, but since it's a short iron in, a good approach shot should lead to a good result.

But where it gets boring and ridiculous for me is when guys consistently miss fairways by a wide margin and have no issue sticking it close and can really hit a so-so approach shot from the 2nd cut of rough and still stick it close.

The problem I have with the argument of 'it's about getting the ball in the hole' is that I think that today's bomb-n-gouge game stacks the odds heavily in the favor of one style of golf. I'd prefer to see a plethora of different styles go at it and then you would truly see who is the best at getting the ball into the cup. I didn't watch this particular tournament this weekend, but that's my problem with Augusta National now. It's a pure bomb-n-putt course with the occasional escape from danger. If you're a David Toms, you really don't stand a chance there. And it wasn't too long ago that wasn't the case.







3JACK

 

[Tball88]

Interesting post, Golf for a long time was a sport that it seemed the average joe could win if he was a straight hitter, had a good short game and can putt. Maybe it's on it's way to being a long drive/putting contest.

You have to wonder if we're starting to get to an era where it's going to become a game that only those who are really physically gifted can win (ie: you're at least 6'3 and can hit the ball a country mile.

The other sports have already gotten there, for the most part and average guy can't succeed at football or basketball. If you're not an absolute monster who has a 40 inch vertical and can run a 4'4 forty, forget about it. It's definately becoming a sport where guys are far more athletic than they have ever been.

Don't know if I have an opinion of if it's good or bad for golf, just a new era. I will say this, seeing long drivers birdie par 5's is about as impressive as watching Shaq dunk a basketball to me.

 

[suns11111]

Well every course on the PGA Tour is a little different, little extreme version is Harbour Town is a great equalizer- Bubba dont play there FYI. Bomb and hack out of the rough is not that hard when the greens are that huge on the PGA Tour. If the Tour really wanted to get back to accuracy they would make the greens small(er), put the pins on the front half of the green. TV audience would be bored........
Wish they would get rids of the dumb groove rule......it has no impact. I have not heard once a pro getting caught with illegal grooves (groove tool or something). Its golf I know (not NFL), but the temptation would be there for a few rotten eggs.

 

[duckjr78]

Meh. Bubba was #1 in GIR last week. Last I checked, that includes par 3's and 4's. So he must have been hitting good shots on all the holes.

The Brian Gay's of the world still win a few tourneys. When he putts lights out and hits a ton of greens. Just like Bubba did.

But, what should we do (in our imaginary wonderland) to bring the shorter player back into contention? We could dial the ball back. Oh wait, that makes the shorter player even shorter. We could grow the rough. Dern, now the short hitter has to hit fairway woods out of the rough on long holes. We could narrow the fairways. Now the short guy misses more fairways and doesn't have the clubhead speed to hit the ball on the green.

Face it. Short hitter benefit from technology just like the big hitters. There are more athletes playing golf now than ever before. They are bigger faster, and stronger.

Is anyone still wanting for 240lb offensive guards in professional football? 6'2" power forwards in the NBA? Nope.

 

[AndyC]

So if it were true that the tour is just about power then the money list should mirror the driving distance list. But that simply isn't the case.

 

[dbl]

The most famous picture of the most famous ball striker (Hogan's 1 iron) was a missed green.

Are you sure? I read he knocked it on the green and 2 putted for par. Just trying to keep the record straight (or find out I'm wrong).

 

[Bigwill]

So if it were true that the tour is just about power then the money list should mirror the driving distance list. But that simply isn't the case.

That said, some of the guys topping the distance stat are doing better in that department than they used to; it used to be that the 185-190 ballspeed-type guys struggled to hang on to their cards. Hopefully, they continue to turn the myth that the longest hitters are just one-trick ponies on its ear.

 

[duckjr78]

I don't get upset at all when a player hits it closer with a wedge out of the hay than another who hits a 7 iron from the middle of the fairway. That's golf. I am however for graduated rough. The farther offline you hit it, the greater the penalty should be.

I do get irritated when these guys get a drop from a shot that air-mailed the stands around the green. Or when a spot in the rough is so trampled that they have a better lie than someone who just barely missed the fairway.

Oh, and out of curiosity, why is there so much more out of bounds on the courses I (a mediocre golfer) play than the courses the pros play? It's a rhetorical question, but really, let's be honest. At least once a round, these guys should have to hit a driver with water on one side and OB on the other. I have to do it, so should they.

 

[Matt 4-L]

The only suggestion I have is if it's equipment that makes these bombers so long, why can't Cory Pavin hit the ball 340 yards?

 

[dbl]

Did the urethane solid ball, help disparately? The 250 hitter hits 270 now, and the 280 hitter hits it 320 now?