The Ghost of TC Chen

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Kevin Shields

Super Moderator
If Mahan wouldve double hit that chip it wouldve followed him the rest of his career. It missed by the hair of my you know what.

That said, tough position to be in. Good grief thats alot of pressure.
 
mgranato

mgranato

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I cannot have more respect for the way Mickelson took charge of the press conference and "protected" Mahan. Tough loss, but that was impressive to see. Phil, Cink, and Furyk showed their metal as team leaders.
 
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Kevin Shields

Super Moderator
mgranato said:
I cannot have more respect for the way Mickelson took charge of the press conference and "protected" Mahan. Tough loss, but that was impressive to see. Phil, Cink, and Furyk showed their metal as team leaders.
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Totally agree. 3 class acts there.
 
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SJO

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I feel so sorry for Mahan, even as a European. You could handle getting beaten but not like that. Hope he's strong.
 
cmartingolf

cmartingolf

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I watched and loved every minute of the Cup. LOVED it regardless of the outcome. Too bad for Mahan. They were both feeling it. McDowell was lucky his chunked iron on 14 didn't go in the soup. He was leaking oil until he busted it down the middle on 16. That calmed him down.

Fowler?? Are you kidding me? The last putts???

Donald vs. Furyk? Amazing.

Tiger? Beatdown Oakland style.

Stricker? Once he got his pivot going he was phenomenal.

Philly Cream Cheese? Awesome.

Poults? The guy was possessed. He made 120' of putts in 14 holes.

Absolutely wonderful golf.

Kaymer and Bubba were out of sorts.
 
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WoodbridgeGolf37

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Mahan's Miss

Is it me or was the bigger mistake the tee shot? He has to win the 17th and the 18th to halve the match.

After watching McDowell almost push his tee shot into the bunker, the opportunity was there for him to hit it anywhere within 25 feet and put even more pressure on Graeme's next shot. Hunter coming-up short with a 5-iron was the real let-down. Trying to stuff a chip was always going to be difficult, particularly to that pin with a soggy lie. The margin for error is non-existent.

I'm not saying I don't feel for the guy: I gained even more respect for him after he asked for the opportunity to finish out the matches. I think that takes incredible huevos. Kudos to him for manning-up and accepting the challenge.
 
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Hayes9801

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Phil Mickelson and Jim Furyk....1-5-1 combined...I wish they proved their mettle on the course instead of in the press room. Maybe it's just me, but Phil just seems like the Eddie Haskell of golf. He seems cool, but you just can't count on him when you need him.
 
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mb6606

New
WoodbridgeGolf37 said:
Is it me or was the bigger mistake the tee shot? He has to win the 17th and the 18th to halve the match.

After watching McDowell almost push his tee shot into the bunker, the opportunity was there for him to hit it anywhere within 25 feet and put even more pressure on Graeme's next shot. Hunter coming-up short with a 5-iron was the real let-down. Trying to stuff a chip was always going to be difficult, particularly to that pin with a soggy lie. The margin for error is non-existent.

I'm not saying I don't feel for the guy: I gained even more respect for him after he asked for the opportunity to finish out the matches. I think that takes incredible huevos. Kudos to him for manning-up and accepting the challenge.
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Mahan simply did not have it Monday - nerves, pressure? Maybe. He was up against a tough competitor. Mahan can hardly be blamed. The US blew any chance the day before with their weak play in the foursomes. Not sure why but the US Team struggles with the team formats versus singles.
 
mgranato

mgranato

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Hayes9801 said:
Phil Mickelson and Jim Furyk....1-5-1 combined...I wish they proved their mettle on the course instead of in the press room. Maybe it's just me, but Phil just seems like the Eddie Haskell of golf. He seems cool, but you just can't count on him when you need him.
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Maybe it is just you...;)

The 95 year Ryder Cup history can be divided into two eras. The first era - the first 56 years when the GB&I team only won 3 times. The second era - since 1985 when the US team has only won 4 times.

Obviously, Mickelson's participation has only occurred during the European dominated era. A losing team record pretty much guarantees that there are no American juggernauts during this time. That being said, NO ONE has scored more points for the US team than Mickelson. He's played in 26 matches with a partner, in 12 of those matches he'd been paired with rookie partners. By comparison, Tiger has played in 23 partner matches, but only 3 have been with rookies.

No one has scored more points than him, AND he's paired with the most green partners - how does that make him Eddie Haskell?:rolleyes:
 
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niblick1

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I know it is classic monday morning quarterbacking, but how could you have Hunter Mahan be the guy to anchor the team? His short game has always been shaky. His list of majors won is sort of short.

Westwood and McDowell are tough and were great number 1 and 12 selections. I don't care how bad Tiger and Phil are playing, they won't flub a little pitch off a tight lie on 17, no matter the pressure. You don't hide them in the line-up on the final day.

Kudos to Fowler for battling back. Selecting Harrington over Casey almost cost the EUR. McIlroy could use a little toughening up, but he's really the player I enjoy watching these days.

Why haven't Donald and Westwood won more PGA events? How many majors should Westwood have won by now?
 
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Hayes9801

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I just saw that Phil now has more losses (17) than any player in Ryder Cup history...and a chunk of those were in singles....can't blame those on a partner.

Eddie Haskell for two reasons. First, from personal observation and from my friends in the press who know him, Phil strives to say the right thing in front of cameras....Nice dress, Mrs. Cleaver. As soon as the cameras are off he's the biggest smartass in the room. Secondly, he can't be counted on when you need him. I believe his singles record is 4-4. That's not awful, but Phil has been one of the top 4 or 5 players in the world for this entire period. He's never played anyone above him in the world rankings, and 4-4 is the best he can do? He's just not the guy you want with you in the fox hole when the bombs start dropping.
 
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Kevin Shields

Super Moderator
niblick1 said:
I know it is classic monday morning quarterbacking, but how could you have Hunter Mahan be the guy to anchor the team? His short game has always been shaky. His list of majors won is sort of short.

Westwood and McDowell are tough and were great number 1 and 12 selections. I don't care how bad Tiger and Phil are playing, they won't flub a little pitch off a tight lie on 17, no matter the pressure. You don't hide them in the line-up on the final day.

Kudos to Fowler for battling back. Selecting Harrington over Casey almost cost the EUR. McIlroy could use a little toughening up, but he's really the player I enjoy watching these days.

Why haven't Donald and Westwood won more PGA events? How many majors should Westwood have won by now?
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Westwoods full swing will always hold him back. He's one of those unreal talents who is better than his swing would indicate IMO. Donald....who knows, definately shouldve won more but its really really hard to win on Tour.
 
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scandres

New
really?

Westwood's swing holds him back? Is there anyone who hits it better than he does? My understanding is that his shortgame has hurt him. I believe his numbers are better than anyone has ever had at PING.
Then again, Nicklaus had a swing that held him back too.....
 
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Kevin Shields

Super Moderator
scandres said:
Westwood's swing holds him back? Is there anyone who hits it better than he does? My understanding is that his shortgame has hurt him. I believe his numbers are better than anyone has ever had at PING.
Then again, Nicklaus had a swing that held him back too.....
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Thats what I mean. He hits it better than his swing would indicate. He did have some Baker-Finch type years where he fell off the map. Always has a few "head dip" stick it in the grounders, and a few left elbow yip hooks. Maybe just enough (combined with the short game) to not not get him over the hump at the majors.
 
mgranato

mgranato

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Hayes9801 said:
Phil Mickelson and Jim Furyk....1-5-1 combined...I wish they proved their mettle on the course instead of in the press room. Maybe it's just me, but Phil just seems like the Eddie Haskell of golf. He seems cool, but you just can't count on him when you need him.
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Hayes9801 said:
I just saw that Phil now has more losses (17) than any player in Ryder Cup history...and a chunk of those were in singles....can't blame those on a partner.

Eddie Haskell for two reasons. First, from personal observation and from my friends in the press who know him, Phil strives to say the right thing in front of cameras....Nice dress, Mrs. Cleaver. As soon as the cameras are off he's the biggest smartass in the room. Secondly, he can't be counted on when you need him. I believe his singles record is 4-4. That's not awful, but Phil has been one of the top 4 or 5 players in the world for this entire period. He's never played anyone above him in the world rankings, and 4-4 is the best he can do? He's just not the guy you want with you in the fox hole when the bombs start dropping.
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Who would you like in the fox hole? Of the players who have been US veterans (at least 3 Cups)...

Love - losing record
Toms - losing record
Leonard - losing record
Cink - losing record
Furyk - losing record
Woods - losing record
Mickelson - losing record

Correct, Mickelson has 17 loses (2.125 loses per Cup). He has also played in 8 Cups - more than any other from his era.

Tiger has 14 loses (2.33 loses per Cup). He's played in 2 less Cups than Mickelson, but has a higher losing percentage while playing with better players.

Furyk has 15 loses (2.14 loses per Cup). He's played in 7 Cups.

If you want to point the finger at Mickelson, you also have to point the finger at the other veterans - especially Furyk and Woods. The reality is both of them are on track to accumulate the same or more loses than Mickelson over the same amount of Cups.

I also find it a bit inconsistent to have a go at Mickelson for being different off camera when his team mate is the poster child for living, selling, and portraying a true double life - and has just as bad a Cup record as Mickelson.

If those are your requirements for a fox hole mate, you may be looking on the team.
 
B

Brian Manzella

Administrator
mgranato said:
The 95 year Ryder Cup history can be divided into two eras. The first era - the first 56 years when the GB&I team only won 3 times. The second era - since 1985 when the US team has only won 4 times.
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From 1985 until 1997 when Tiger really became Tiger, the EUROs won some because the US players were soft from making easy money on the US Tour where nobody ruffled any feathers.

From 1997-2001/2ish, Tiger RUINED a generation of top players by kicking their asses.

So, the guys who became good tour players since the Tiger Slam have NOT been soft, or KNOCKED DOWN a notch.

These are the guys who will get the cup back and keep it.

I would bet on it.
 
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Bigwill

New
Brian Manzella said:
From 1985 until 1997 when Tiger really became Tiger, the EUROs won some because the US players were soft from making easy money on the US Tour where nobody ruffled any feathers.

From 1997-2001/2ish, Tiger RUINED a generation of top players by kicking their asses.

So, the guys who became good tour players since the Tiger Slam have NOT been soft, or KNOCKED DOWN a notch.

These are the guys who will get the cup back and keep it.

I would bet on it.
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I agree with that. It seems that a lot of the younger players coming out now have more of the "other sports" mentality than the guys before. I think that they'll relish the team aspect and the atmosphere a lot more, especially when they have home field advantage (which is so much bigger in the Ryder Cup than in any other golfing competition, period). I think that if you got guys like Overton, Bubba, JB, Fowler etc. on a roll at home, with the crowd behind them, they'd really be tough to beat.
 
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