The Pulls

[Shot Limit]

I have been hitting my irons really well lately. Long, strait with a little 5 yd draw, and getting that good compression feeling. They were really my only saving grace due to all of the trouble my driver inconsistancies were causing. I usually don't practice too often with the driver. I figure, I use my irons a larger percentage of the time so I dedicate more practice time to the irons. I feel as confident as I ever have standing over the ball with my irons, even the long irons, which is great progress for me. Of course, I still have my misses.

Last Friday I decided to really focus on the the driver at the range. I really think I made a break through and by the end of the range session I felt really good about my progress.

I played a round on Sunday. First tee box I roped a drive right down the center of the fairway, sweet! I had about 150ish left to the hole, went with 8 iron and pulled it about 35 yds left of the green. No biggie, this has typically been my miss and I still got up and down for par.

Hole #2, par 3-183 yds, attempted a nice smooth five iron, but pulled it. It started about 15 yards left then hooked about 15 more yds left and then splash, in the drink. I was starting to get a pinch concerned so I took few practice swings, they felt good...I can fix this. Dropped another ball to give it one more go and same exact thing happens. A little more concerned now, let's move on before this gets tin cup ugly.

Next tee box, I roped another drive on to the fairway. I don't normally have sucess like that with driver so I wasn't having a horrible day, something was going right.

Long story short, I nailed my driver all day and pulled damn near every iron shot. Chipping and pitching was ok, it was really just full swing shots.

QUESTION: What are the possible causes for the pulls besides the obvious, swinging way too far left?

I haven't had any time to work on it yet at the range. I have been just swinging the club in the living room and noticed excessive hip slide and maybe too much axis tilt. Could these be possible causes if I'm not swinging too far left?

All feedback wanted and welcome!

Thanks guys, Neil.

 

[Brian Manzella]

Upside down.

What are the possible causes for the pulls besides the obvious, swinging way too far left?

I think you are now swinging too far to the right with the irons.

You shallowed out your swing, and moved low point back, to help your driver improve, but now these adjustments have made the iron swing path too far to the RIGHT.

Weird game, huh?

 

[pieman]

so do you achieve a middle ground, or just realize you have to have 2 different thoughts depending on the club used?

 

[savydan]

so do you achieve a middle ground, or just realize you have to have 2 different thoughts depending on the club used?

Darn good question. I think Trackman is telling us we need to adjust our set ups at the least.

 

[daveh]

I think you are now swinging too far to the right with the irons.

You shallowed out your swing, and moved low point back, to help your driver improve, but now these adjustments have made the iron swing path too far to the RIGHT.

Weird game, huh?

Please pardon my ignorance....

I have a bout 10 questions about this statement, but I'll stick with just two.

1 - What about the changes mentioned would cause the swing path to be too far right?

2 - How does a swing path too far to the right cause a pull? I just can't picture this.

 

[Scottgas2]

D-Plane

See previous discussions esp. NHA.

Brian,
How do you "shallow out" the swing path of the driver?

 

[ggsjpc]

Answers

Please pardon my ignorance....

I have a bout 10 questions about this statement, but I'll stick with just two.

1 - What about the changes mentioned would cause the swing path to be too far right?

2 - How does a swing path too far to the right cause a pull? I just can't picture this.

1) player noted excessive hip slide and axis tilt. Both will cause a swing more to the right.

2) clubface.


Based on the description of left to left, I think he was just getting the face closed early with a swing more to the right. I think after his driver work, he developed a "timing" of when to start closing the face and then applied this "timing" to his irons.

Possible that driver backswing created a more open face as swing got longer which required an earlier squaring of the face to hit well. Iron swing a little shorter and less open. Same amount of squaring the face now produces pull draw because face is coming in shut.

 

[ggsjpc]

Not Brian, but my 2 cents

See previous discussions esp. NHA.

Brian,
How do you "shallow out" the swing path of the driver?

The more right the direction of the swing, the more shallow the swing path.

 

[Shot Limit]

Thanks for all the replies guys!

I agree I'm swing to far to the right with the irons, which is closing the face early. Every shot looked like I was trying to bend it around trees, even the shots that started a little right of the target line had about a 15 yard draw.

The funny part is.... When working on the driver, I actually steepend my swing path on the BS. Not sure about the DS but definitly the BS and this produced my best shots. The feeling of a steeper turn is what I brought on the course with me.

Weird game, huh?

Damn straight, gotta love it!

 

[savydan]

I think very perceptive detective work by B-man. Not that I would expect anything else.

The key evidence is that your "pulled" iron shots actually have curvature left which means path going more right than your clubface.

Combine that with good driving results and the conclusion is that your left iron shots are actually hooks and not pulls and that you are swinging too far to the right.

 

[ggsjpc]

The OP mentioned the ball started left of target and went more left. This must be path right of face and face left of target.

 

[Shot Limit]

The OP mentioned the ball started left of target and went more left. This must be path right of face and face left of target.

I can't take the opposing view here.

I'm going to try and get to the range after work today and work on this issue. Less hip slide will be my initial focus. Leaving it alone and swinging more left just seems like the ball will start more left and continue to go left.

Good place to start?

 

[daveh]

1) player noted excessive hip slide and axis tilt. Both will cause a swing more to the right.

2) clubface.


Based on the description of left to left, I think he was just getting the face closed early with a swing more to the right. I think after his driver work, he developed a "timing" of when to start closing the face and then applied this "timing" to his irons.

Possible that driver backswing created a more open face as swing got longer which required an earlier squaring of the face to hit well. Iron swing a little shorter and less open. Same amount of squaring the face now produces pull draw because face is coming in shut.

Gotcha! Thanks for the explanation.

 

[ggsjpc]

I can't take the opposing view here.

I'm going to try and get to the range after work today and work on this issue. Less hip slide will be my initial focus. Leaving it alone and swinging more left just seems like the ball will start more left and continue to go left.

Good place to start?

Sure. Just don't forget about the face.

 

[Shot Limit]

Sure. Just don't forget about the face.

With my irons the face usually takes care of itself naturally. I usually only have to think about squaring up with the driver...

 

[ggsjpc]

Ok. good luck at the range. I hope it goes well.

 

[Shot Limit]

update

Ok. All the shots weren't horrible this time. I hit about 140 balls this eve with about 30 good shots. Focusing on less hip slide really did not have the effect I had hoped for. On the plus side, my shots were starting straight but there was still 15-20 yds draw.

Not sure if I should abandon the hip slide theory or not. A new theory has now popped into my head. I have a feeling that I may be underplane on the ds now.

So my question for everyone is: What type a ball flight is produced by bps?
Thank you to all.

 

[vjsinger]

Why do you think it is only DS related? Maybe you have "fake" axis tilt..it is a possibility, I could produce the shots you describe with that. It could be set-up in the backswing.

 

[Shot Limit]

Why do you think it is only DS related? Maybe you have "fake" axis tilt..it is a possibility, I could produce the shots you describe with that. It could be set-up in the backswing.

I checked out my swing on video and my bs seems fine to me; on plane, flw at the top. I'm thinking I may have too much drop on the ds.

What is "fake" axis tilt vj?

 

[vjsinger]

I checked out my swing on video and my bs seems fine to me; on plane, flw at the top. I'm thinking I may have too much drop on the ds.

What is "fake" axis tilt vj?

I describe it as hanging on your right side a little and kicking your hips toward the ball on the DS.