tiger and trackman interview....

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birly-shirly

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Michael Finney said:
NOT THE OTHER WAY AS FIRST PRESUMED BY MANY

PRESUMED

wulsy, the trackman parameters which are measured and calculated have been on the trackman website and in the newsletters from day 1 - at no time did they ever try to pull the wool over anyone's eyes about what their monitor could measure.....now this revelation is sweeping through tens and tens of people on another forum....they are astonished that trackman doesn't directly measure the face....ping has verified its accuracy and that is good enough for me....and evidently good enough for paul wood....what people PRESUMED on other golf forums is not the concern - people presumed the ball started on the path for 100 years - does that make trackman bad?

going to dinner one night, i was lucky enough to listen in on a great conversation between tuxen and wood about ping's future interest in trackman products and developments - let's just say that there is genuine respect between the two men and their companies as they move forward...
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Mike - what do you believe did ping actually verify?

Do you believe that they verified that TM returns accurate club data for non-CoG impacts?

I imagine there would be lots of scenarios in which Ping would legitimately be only interested in the ball data, not club data. If they're testing with Pingman, then they CONTROL the clubdata, so would not need to measure it.
 
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wulsy

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birls, the correlation (face/path=d-plane) could ONLY be confirmed if the club was CONTROLLED as was therefore a known variable. No?
 
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wulsy

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Probably would have. But there's TMIII for a reason, no? TMI and TMII had some kind of weakness...

However by measuring EVERYTHING you can CONFIRM everything and refute any doubters.
 
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birly-shirly

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birly-shirly said:
Mike - what do you believe did ping actually verify?

Do you believe that they verified that TM returns accurate club data for non-CoG impacts?

I imagine there would be lots of scenarios in which Ping would legitimately be only interested in the ball data, not club data. If they're testing with Pingman, then they CONTROL the clubdata, so would not need to measure it.
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Just this. Just curious. Not trying to prove anything. Not trying to bring down anyone's business empire. Just sayin'
 
drewyallop

drewyallop

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mgranato said:
Isn't this an example of the cruelty of sport?

When an athlete's skills are at their sharpest, they know the least about their craft. Yet they can still perform at extraordinary levels.

When an athlete's knowledge is at their highest, they have a diminished level of skill. They understand at a higher level than they perform.

"If only I knew 10 years ago what I know now..." is a phrase uttered by EVERY athlete.
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Nice.

BTW what is that on your face?
 
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Kevin Shields

Super Moderator
wulsy said:
@Kevin

Hitting down = path more right. Hitting up = path more left. Fade = face slightly open to path> Draw = face slightly closed to path.

So the more you hit down the more your face must be open to your "alignment/swing direction" in order to hit a slight fade that even resembles something that starts slightly left of the target-line in order to fade back to the target. At some point, when you hit down on it, it becomes difficult to keep the face open to the rightwards path and the relationship between path and face become such that it is less likely that the face is actually open to path. And so the shape of the shot become unpredictable. So hitting more down, or more up for that matter, is a BUM DEAL. Hence why the tour pros (as far as I know) shy away from hitting up big time with the driver.

Make sense, Tiger?
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Why are you calling me Tiger? You're the one that posted about having to be a player to know how to do something in the decel thread. I'm just saying that's how a lot of good players do it. Down and left for a fade.....up and right for a draw
 
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DCgolf

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Michael Finney said:
sean foley has leaned on james leitz for trackman interpretation.......James has leaned on Brian and Brian to a certain degree has leaned on James....

there was a point in time last year where foley looked like he was going to lean on iteachgolf, but he settled in the end on james leitz.....who interestingly enough was indirectly dragged toward the golfing machine by brian and has been since indirectly dragged away from the golfing machine..

and so it goes
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None of us is as smart as all of us.
 
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DCgolf

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What I find interesting is here's a guy who won an open by 15, a Masters by 12, a British by 8 and three WGCs by 9 or more, and he was "clueless" about ball flight. Are we to assume that had he known TRACKMAN numbers he would have been better? I am a TRACKMAN owner and user but I dont think the game can be reduced to math and science. All things being equal (everybody having all the numbers) does not mean they have the same talent to implement that knowledge.
 
Steve Greffen

Steve Greffen

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DCgolf said:
What I find interesting is here's a guy who won an open by 15, a Masters by 12, a British by 8 and three WGCs by 9 or more, and he was "clueless" about ball flight. Are we to assume that had he known TRACKMAN numbers he would have been better? I am a TRACKMAN owner and user but I dont think the game can be reduced to math and science. All things being equal (everybody having all the numbers) does not mean they have the same talent to implement that knowledge.
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I hear you DC and can understand how you could say that and when he was on those tears at those events I'm sure a trackman would not have been necessary to hit it better, but what about to validate what he was doing right so that when he went into a swing funk he knew what to change? I also think that having a trackman when he was with Haney could have helped tremendously. (possibly to alert Tiger to run as fast as possible from him;)) I can't help but think back to those times where I saw Tiger on the course after he just hit a shot 50 yards off line and apart from his anger he looked like he had no clue as to what he just did, no clue. Having a clue could have helped with Haney and I think will help and is helping currently with Foley.

Of course having technology like this requires the art to use it effectively and we could all suppose how Haney would have used (misused) it and how Foley may be learning on the fly but look what happens when someone knows what they are doing? 80 spots.
 
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Brian Manzella

Administrator
You can verify TrackMan's face numbers easily if you have a good enough camera.

No, the Casio's are really NOT good enough.

Ping has cameras that are—easily.
 
Michael Finney

Michael Finney

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yes, they verify face angle with 100,000 frame a second cameras....casios go all the way up to 1000....does that answer your question?
 
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