What Kind of Release is this? & Can an effective swing include no deceleration?

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Dariusz J.

Dariusz J.

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Let me ask one question -- how is one able to classify the release type when a direct post-impact configuration of wrist is not shown ? I presume we're not talking hackers but accomplished golfers that always deliver flat lead wrist at contact.
If we are being shown what happens pre-impact we can DEDUCT WITH A DOSE OF PROBABILITY if it's crossover release or not ONLY.
Release is a physical phenomenon that lasts in time and does not stop at contact. It's a continuous process.

Cheers
 
Michael Finney

Michael Finney

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Would someone really say that because of a youtube video of a PGA Tour player, that they would stake their crappy "reputation" on the perceived fact that IT LOOKS LIKE the hips don't slow their rotational rate nearing impact?
 
Dariusz J.

Dariusz J.

New member
Brian Manzella said:
Post Impact is in the three golfer sequences.

YOU HAVE NO CHANCE WITHOUT 3D CAPTURE OR THE EQUIVALENT.
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Well, I am always trying to think 3-D and I am very sure I can define release type in Cotton's terms provided I am given enough data. FO sequence tells a lot as regards lead wrist movement while DTL shows the RoC. I can say ALWAYS who is close to crossover, slap-hinge or push.
I am out of the discussion if we're talking about some unknown to me, probably goofy, release classification.

Hope I am clear, cheers.
 
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spktho

New
The problem I see with all the differing classification systems for "the release" is that at any given point during a swing, every golfer has some elements of every release classification. So the classification of "the release" then boils down to timing of the elements. That can then be characterized into sequencing of all the body parts which more than likely has the greater affect on "the release".

My reason for placing quotations around "the release" is because the term itself implies that something is being held back and then released at some point. Just some of my anecdotal experiences: I'm not an elite golfer by all measures, but when I'm hitting the ball at my best, there is nothing being held back. I have a strong suspicion this is true for the elite golfers as well. In the past, I have tried holding off any release to get the forward leaning shaft with the flw keeping the clubface square well before and past impact and so on; without achieving that look on video and more importantly, not hitting the ball better. I can get that look on video now by speeding up my arm swing sooner into the downswing on a more vertical handpath, not by holding of "the release".

Anyway, carry on with this debate, I will continue reading and assimilating the information for my own swing.
 
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B

Brian Manzella

Administrator
Maybe folks just don't realize that the pelvis and torso ARE SUPPOSED TO BE MOVING during impact.

Just really, really, REALLY decelerated.
 
Dariusz J.

Dariusz J.

New member
Brian Manzella said:
Maybe folks just don't realize that the pelvis and torso ARE SUPPOSED TO BE MOVING during impact.

Just really, really, REALLY decelerated.
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Of course they do and they deccelerate sequentially. Brian, have you seen anyone good deccelerating shoulders before starting to deccelerate hips ? It's a serious question.

Cheers
 
C

cwdlaw223

New
Michael Finney said:
Would someone really say that because of a youtube video of a PGA Tour player, that they would stake their crappy "reputation" on the perceived fact that IT LOOKS LIKE the hips don't slow their rotational rate nearing impact?
Click to expand...

Yes. That person might even have a "student" who disparages Trackman's face angle calculation for over a year and turn around and buy one this year. Next that student claims he doesn't need scientists and yet he's now trying to conduct "scientific" experiments. Makes sense. Of course, if you write enough down on your quasi golfing website you'll eventually catch every release style known to man. My favorite is that there's now nothing driving or holding in a drive/hold release.
 
B

Brian Manzella

Administrator
3D's readouts of PGA Tour Players don't grow on trees, but among the group, we have several. Working on a couple.

The chart below should help some, it is from AMM capture Data from TPI, and was presented by James Leitz at a talk he gave....

leitz3Dtalk.jpg
 
O

OLIVER1

New
It's odd. I'm not a statistics guy but crikey those numbers paint quite a vivid picture for me.
Thanks for posting them up, Brian... Great stuff.
 
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GeoffDickson

New
The tour impact pelvis rotation speed is 66% of max hip rotation.
The amateur pelvis rotation speed is 65% of max hip rotation.

Pelvis slide is 72 and 69% respectively.

Not sure if this means anything....i suspect it means to concentrate on generating the speed...the slowing down part will look after itself 'naturally'.
 
tongzilla

tongzilla

New
GeoffDickson said:
The tour impact pelvis rotation speed is 66% of max hip rotation.
The amateur pelvis rotation speed is 65% of max hip rotation.

Pelvis slide is 72 and 69% respectively.

Not sure if this means anything....i suspect it means to concentrate on generating the speed...the slowing down part will look after itself 'naturally'.
Click to expand...
Yea I think so. If you ask me to create more clubhead speed, I would swing faster, not decelerate more.
A lot of this data gives us "permission" to abandom ridiculous beliefs...such as keeping the right wrist bent. Clearly the right wrist flattens (from extension to flexion) at an increasing rate during release.
 
K

Kevin Shields

Super Moderator
Brian Manzella said:
3D's readouts of PGA Tour Players don't grow on trees, but among the group, we have several. Working on a couple.

The chart below should help some, it is from AMM capture Data from TPI, and was presented by James Leitz at a talk he gave....

leitz3Dtalk.jpg
Click to expand...

Was there any data on white player badge rotation?
 
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