natep
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Unless you have "exquisite" timing?
Why high hands at the top?
- Thread starter drewyallop
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Unless you have "exquisite" timing?
Dariusz J.
New member
Moment, moment. The science is anatomy. The shoulder joints alone are too weak to ensure best possible control about the movement of arms. It is obvious that the more humerus bones are subdued to the main body motion the more consistent/repeatable it is. One does not need rocket science to prove it.
That's why 95 % of golfers that are being regarded as best and most reliable ballstrikers were low plane golfers. And the comparison of Nicklaus or Miller to post-secret Hogan is simply a JOKE. If what they said about Hogan is not enough for someone, it is enough to ask directly both Nicklaus and Miller how much Hogan was better than themselves in ballstriking class and wait for the answers.
Having said this, the necessity for slightly higher planes today is quite justified since distance plays alas bigger and bigger role in today's golf and no doubt, kinematically, the so-called one plane swings are inferior in this field also because of anatomy and simple physics.
Cheers
That's why 95 % of golfers that are being regarded as best and most reliable ballstrikers were low plane golfers. And the comparison of Nicklaus or Miller to post-secret Hogan is simply a JOKE. If what they said about Hogan is not enough for someone, it is enough to ask directly both Nicklaus and Miller how much Hogan was better than themselves in ballstriking class and wait for the answers.
Having said this, the necessity for slightly higher planes today is quite justified since distance plays alas bigger and bigger role in today's golf and no doubt, kinematically, the so-called one plane swings are inferior in this field also because of anatomy and simple physics.
Cheers
drewyallop
New
Do you have evidence of this D?
BTW Dr Neal talks at length about the importance of shoulder strength in the anti-summit video.
Drew
Dariusz J.
New member
Of course. Here is the quote from Wikipedia (I haven't got my books with me now):
"The muscles and joints of the shoulder allow it to move through a remarkable range of motion, making it the most mobile joint in the human body.[citation needed] The shoulder can abduct, adduct (such as during the shoulder fly), rotate, be raised in front of and behind the torso and move through a full 360° in the sagittal plane. This tremendous range of motion also makes the shoulder extremely unstable, far more prone to dislocation and injury than other joints."
Add to the consideration the mass of arms and their length and you'll have the big picture.
Cheers
P.S. No surprise dr Neal talked about the importance of shoulder strength. He's not ignorant for sure.
"The muscles and joints of the shoulder allow it to move through a remarkable range of motion, making it the most mobile joint in the human body.[citation needed] The shoulder can abduct, adduct (such as during the shoulder fly), rotate, be raised in front of and behind the torso and move through a full 360° in the sagittal plane. This tremendous range of motion also makes the shoulder extremely unstable, far more prone to dislocation and injury than other joints."
Add to the consideration the mass of arms and their length and you'll have the big picture.
Cheers
P.S. No surprise dr Neal talked about the importance of shoulder strength. He's not ignorant for sure.
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
You can have high hands and a low plane angle, in fact its preferred
Brian Manzella
Administrator
This is a CRITICAL POINT!!!!
I am talking about TOP OF THE BACKSWING shoulder-to-back turn difference.
Not whether his "Eventual Plane" was the "elbow plane," or any other steeper plane.
Just so you know, Dustin Johnson's left shoulder moves 60° more than his back.
One of our "Project 1.68" scientist, (not Rob Neal—and don't ask who) has done a lot of research on the strength to weight ratio of the shoulder area.
I will get a basic answer that will semi-satisfy without spilling to many beans.....
ffejeff224
New
Maybe I am stupid, but for the life of me I can't figure out what this means. The difference between how much the shoulder turns and how much the back turns? I guess I want to know what points on the body you are using to measure this because I can't picture it in my head.
Phil Rosenbaum
New
the shoulders move independantly of the spine. you can sorta see it in 2d, but in 3d, a whole new ballgame.
Dariusz J.
New member
Do you mean a 2-planer with palmar flexion at the top a'la Dustin Johnson ?
Cheers
matt kluck
New
Golfdad
Do not forget the "critical point" mentioned in the thread by Brian when trying this on your own.
MK
Do not forget the "critical point" mentioned in the thread by Brian when trying this on your own.
MK
This would be the opposite of high hands.It has been said that Doug Sanders only ever leaves the fairway to make phone calls.I don't think he was very long though.
High hands or low hands,I think you should do whatever is in your golf DNA.Would anyone lower Jim Furyks hands or get Doug to raise his hands higher?
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High hands or low hands,I think you should do whatever is in your golf DNA.Would anyone lower Jim Furyks hands or get Doug to raise his hands higher?
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drewyallop
New
Think higher hands not high hands. I agree that not many can reach as high as most pros. My notion is that getting the hands higher by any amount will increase club velocity and have other benefits as well. Higher was definitely outside my comfort zone at first but with practice, swinging became easier for some reason; definitely less stress on the body, esp. the lead shoulder..
With reference to shoulder strength, pivoting a laid off backswing with arms close to the chest intuitively seems to put more torque on the lead shoulder; a higher hands swing that allows the shoulder/arm/club system to free wheel seems less stressful and quicker.
Drew
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