2004 PGA Teaching and Coaching Summit

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Alright, I'm tired of trying to defend something that really could defend itself. YOu are all seeking out it's destruction instead of looking for it's benefits... as a result you'll produce any objection imaginable, and in a way demonizing something that is inherently good.

Eventually you teach the student to throw the club while a ball is there.. fusing the two mentalities into one. But since it's such a horrible and utterly stupid drill I guess none of you well ever find it of use. Good day.
 
The guy in your pictures does look much better at the both arms straight position in the followthrough. I just wondered how dramatically the drill would help a caster. The guy in the pictures does not appear to be a caster, but does have a random sweep type release, and breakdown through the ball in his regular swing. The drill does appear to make this much better!

I met a teacher at the Summit one year that strongly believed in this drill. He said he had a barrel of old clubs he used for the throwing drill.
 
Ringer,

I'd be very interested in seeing the post-drill Swing actually hitting a ball. In particular, the frame at impact from a face-on view. Do you have that?
 
Unfortunately the video didn't have a fast enough frame rate set when I video'd it...so all i can show of his swing was just before and just after impact.

pat-10.jpg
 
When you can show him actually hitting a ball with those after pictures then you will have something.
Come out to the Mesa Golf Center and I'll show you pictures on my A-Star of people who have learned rythmn(Homer's definition). I mean no disrespect and I am not bragging with this post.
You have my vote for the one who has learned the most (Matthew is close)on this forum. And Brian's has learned a few things from Lynn.
 
denny.. I appreciate the vote. Didn't know there was a poll being take. :D

This was just a 15 minute session as I said. There is some sugnificant progress between pre and post drill swing even in that limited time. The trick is teaching him how to change his mentality when the ball is there. If I were to try to make positions occur at impact (which have tried to teach in the past), it would take much longer for progress to be made. It's difficult to tell, but his tendency to slap at the ball with his right hand was not quite as sugnificant in his post swing. He just does not as of yet BELIEVE he can hit the ball without doing that motion. He can recognize how possible it is to make the right move, but convincing one's self that you can do it and strike the ball at the same time is a rather large leap for most people. Including 90% of the people attending this board. You'll notice most of their objections step from that gap.

If I were to show Pat's Club Throwing motion side by side with, say Craig Stadler.. just how similar might they be? When I compare my swing to the one where I"m throwing clubs, there is nearly no difference, but what differences there are, are EXACTLY what I'm trying to improve.

I have found that the absolute best drill is to throw and hit at the same time. It's difficult to get the mind set on doing it... but when you do, the feeling is sweet.

Swingeasttowest - Yes.. and how much clubhead throw away does he have doing the drill?
 
Ringer,

From those two photos, it's certain that the shaft is not slanting forward at impact. He's also still quitting with that non-rotating bent left wrist. In the 2nd frame, his left arm and shaft should be in a straight line. These are the things he should be taught DIRECTLY rather than slinging clubs, which won't get him there.
 
Miz.. did he do them when he was slinging the clubs? By golly yes he was. So then why can't this be a way to learn? He didn't KNOW about the right arm until he threw clubs. But just how many instructors do you imagine he went to that all pointed this problem out to him?.. taking the approach of "DIRECTLY"? Yet he actually DID it.. and KNEW he did it right when he threw the clubs. He never knew it, felt it, believed it, until he threw the clubs. He was teaching himself what it was supposed to FEEL LIKE.

No matter how many times I showed him what he was doing, or told him what he was doing... he needed to FEEL it. He needed to FEEL right and wrong... and clubthrowing made him feel right and wrong. I'm sure if I would have had him swing without a ball, after the drill, his swing would have looked just fine. But the ball becomes an obstacle.
 
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