It's amazing people here have not taken into account ball position.He plays the ball almost outside his right foot.If the ball was just inside his right heel(as I'm sure he does with his irons) he would have a forward leaning shaft with the same swing.He is still hitting 'down' as the shaft is leaning forward in relation to his spine at impact.Perhaps that's how you hit up while swinging 'down'.Position the ball well forward and make the same 'down' swing.It's not necessary to have a forward leaning shaft at impact with the driver as the ball is high on a tee.
Check out Bubba Watson
- Thread starter Archie Swivel
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If you move the pivot center - upper spine - you move the left shoulder and low point w/ it. Unless you have stationary head or stationary upper spine, your impact fix left shoulder position doesn't define the low point.
Bubba has a set-up w/ ball outside his lead shoulder at impact* -> the club head is moving up during impact interval.
If you release early, you can have in-line conditions before low-point - but this is inefficient and you need some kind of a bail out plan. Usually in form of a flip, which is a swing fault and manipulates the low point.
I'd like to see a video of someone hitting a full throttle 7i w/o bailing out and pushing thru the mud w/ a TGM finnish swiwel.
Left shoulder moving around the neck has very little to do with this.
Most of us can't even decipher his scibledigook - or mathledigook - let a lone understand what he is trying to prove.
Vaako
* There was also some left wrist deal Brian explained ages ago, but can't find it now.
birdie_man
New
Ya it's weird eh David.
Him and Laura Davies.
David Alford
New
Vaako wrote:
>If you release early, you can have in-line conditions before low-point - but this is inefficient and you need some kind of a bail out plan. Usually in form of a flip, which is a swing fault and manipulates the low point.
OTOH, hands in front of the clubshaft/clubface is not an inline condition.
Biomechanically, I'd like to see some well structured experiments to test whether hands infront is actually less powerful than a perfect in line orientation.
>If you release early, you can have in-line conditions before low-point - but this is inefficient and you need some kind of a bail out plan. Usually in form of a flip, which is a swing fault and manipulates the low point.
OTOH, hands in front of the clubshaft/clubface is not an inline condition.
Biomechanically, I'd like to see some well structured experiments to test whether hands infront is actually less powerful than a perfect in line orientation.
tongzilla
New
This is the difference between a HACKER hitting up with this driver, and Bubba.
The HACKER hits up BEFORE the true low point is reached.
Bubba the Pro has his clubhead going DOWN and out all the way to low point. It's (almost) impossible to do that even with the slightest inclination to hit up. The clubhead WILL go up after low point.
The HACKER hits up BEFORE the true low point is reached.
Bubba the Pro has his clubhead going DOWN and out all the way to low point. It's (almost) impossible to do that even with the slightest inclination to hit up. The clubhead WILL go up after low point.
birdie_man
New
Good point....hackers Bend their Left Wrists....sustain the Lag.....
tourdeep
New
birdie_man
New
Brian....
You're gonna prolly hate me for resurrecting this.....but....
We didn't get your take. What is Bubba doing?
Clubhead is going up.....what about the thrust?....and the Flat Left Wrist?.....and....can you hit up with a Flat LWrist?....etc......the whole shebang.
Cause his ball is clearly outside the LShoulder.....the LShoulder is Lowpoint....."it's as low as your hands can get, then they start moving up" as you said in "Former Flipper".....(you said something like that anyway...lol).
I need closure man!!!! Closure!!!!!! ARRGHGRHAGRhgrahgRauguyAF a76fgjbaHfaiw7ufg!!!
...
What I see.....is that Bubba's hands are past his Left Shoulder at Impact in that sequence....past Low Point....the lowest point of swing.....hands start going up after LShoulder, as in Flipper.....(so are his hands in fact hitting up?).....
And- if he is......his LWrist IS still Flat.....BTW....
Need to know this.
I think you could say his clubhead is moving UP.....and I actually suspect that his hands also are.....(IMO)....
(BTW.....I don't deny that Low Point is LShoulder, etc. etc....and, regardless of whatever the prognosis ends up being here, I DO know that you prolly SHOULD hit down to better ensure the maintenance of a Flat Left Wrist at Impact....)
You're gonna prolly hate me for resurrecting this.....but....
We didn't get your take. What is Bubba doing?
Clubhead is going up.....what about the thrust?....and the Flat Left Wrist?.....and....can you hit up with a Flat LWrist?....etc......the whole shebang.
Cause his ball is clearly outside the LShoulder.....the LShoulder is Lowpoint....."it's as low as your hands can get, then they start moving up" as you said in "Former Flipper".....(you said something like that anyway...lol).
I need closure man!!!! Closure!!!!!! ARRGHGRHAGRhgrahgRauguyAF a76fgjbaHfaiw7ufg!!!
...
What I see.....is that Bubba's hands are past his Left Shoulder at Impact in that sequence....past Low Point....the lowest point of swing.....hands start going up after LShoulder, as in Flipper.....(so are his hands in fact hitting up?).....
And- if he is......his LWrist IS still Flat.....BTW....
Need to know this.
I think you could say his clubhead is moving UP.....and I actually suspect that his hands also are.....(IMO)....
(BTW.....I don't deny that Low Point is LShoulder, etc. etc....and, regardless of whatever the prognosis ends up being here, I DO know that you prolly SHOULD hit down to better ensure the maintenance of a Flat Left Wrist at Impact....)
palmreader
New
Well...You cannot have a club head going up with hands (hinge of the lever) going down no matter who says what.... That damn club is a straight line....
birdie_man
New
I was just screwing around with this "Thrust hitting down" idea in a reflection.
There is no doubt that, in relation to the ground, the hands (really it's the right hand that is driving [Hitting] or being Thrown Out [Swinging]...but w/e who cares....I'll just say "hands" for this post) will be hitting down when they are before the l. shoulder and hitting up when they are after the l. shoulder....
That's easy to see.....just look in a mirror and watch them.....they travel down, then travel up when they reach the left shoulder.
...
But this Thrust thing is what's getting me....
The body tilts through Impact.....Axis Tilt....
What are the hands doing in relation to this tilted body? i.e. don't relate them to the ground....maybe relate them the the shoulder line. There is a definate feel of still "hitting down" all the way up until the right arm straightens.
I've heard "the Thrust continues down-Plane," or w/e....
But how about "the Thrust continues until Follow Through" (both arms straight).
....I've never really thought about this before....
Know what I mean though?.....go to right before both arms straight (Follow Through).....in relation to the ground, the hands are moving up.....no question (and they are past Low Point- l. shoulder).....but now "de-Tilt your Axis," if you know what I mean.....the hands seem to hit down (i.e. the extending feeling of the right arm) continues until the belly-button or so.....well, I guess until both arms straighten.
Dunno if I'm just regurgitating something you guys already know in here lol......or stuff that doesn't make any sense.....I guess if nothing else it's me getting my thoughts out (and straightened out).
There is no doubt that, in relation to the ground, the hands (really it's the right hand that is driving [Hitting] or being Thrown Out [Swinging]...but w/e who cares....I'll just say "hands" for this post) will be hitting down when they are before the l. shoulder and hitting up when they are after the l. shoulder....
That's easy to see.....just look in a mirror and watch them.....they travel down, then travel up when they reach the left shoulder.
...
But this Thrust thing is what's getting me....
The body tilts through Impact.....Axis Tilt....
What are the hands doing in relation to this tilted body? i.e. don't relate them to the ground....maybe relate them the the shoulder line. There is a definate feel of still "hitting down" all the way up until the right arm straightens.
I've heard "the Thrust continues down-Plane," or w/e....
But how about "the Thrust continues until Follow Through" (both arms straight).
....I've never really thought about this before....
Know what I mean though?.....go to right before both arms straight (Follow Through).....in relation to the ground, the hands are moving up.....no question (and they are past Low Point- l. shoulder).....but now "de-Tilt your Axis," if you know what I mean.....the hands seem to hit down (i.e. the extending feeling of the right arm) continues until the belly-button or so.....well, I guess until both arms straighten.
Dunno if I'm just regurgitating something you guys already know in here lol......or stuff that doesn't make any sense.....I guess if nothing else it's me getting my thoughts out (and straightened out).
birdie_man
New
Unless the LWrist Bends.....no? But then again.....now that you've done that, the Lev. Assembly (arms, hands) is no longer moving down as a unit or w/e.........what I mean is- flipping the hands (Bending the LWrist) would seem to deflect any hitting down .....whether the watch on your wrist is moving down or not. Seems like there would no longer be any real downward thrust there with the hands flipping (from what I can see- when you flip, the hands are essentially moving up in an arc around the wristbone....follow the movement of a knuckle on the left hand or something).
palmreader
New
You are right birdieman...You have to flip, that is the only way club head goes up while the hand (hinge) goes down. There must be something wrong with the geometry, otherwise......
Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
Incorrect. I'll give you a hint, the club is not in a straight line for probably 99% of the stroke.
palmreader
New
Well...Jim, There is little bending due to stressing the shaft (a lot more in case of Bobby Schaffer at the top of the swing). You are stretching it if you tell me that slight bending at the impact accounts for club head going up while hands going down.... Let's be real. Take a club and see if you could move the head up while moving hands down, and let me know.
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