Check out Bubba Watson
- Thread starter Archie Swivel
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palmreader
New
Birdie, What is the "thrust" that you all are discussing??? Is it some kind of a force applied by the right hand?
Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
I still don't understand why none of you cannot comprehend that how a shaft bends and un-bends throughout the swing has a giant effect on launch conditions.
Where you tee the ball, what shaft you are using, how stiff that shaft is, what hinging you use, how flat/arched/bent your wrist is, how much axis tilt you have, how much leakage through impact you have, where you're hitting it on the face, i could go on forever.
This all has a huge effect on fittings on this is why i can do it better than most because i understand how it all effects given launch conditions. Most fitters simply look at the numbers and do what the puter says to make you hit it farther. Sure maybe that gets you "on the right track" but i'm gonna be the one who can help fix your leakage, then fit you into the right gear, and then teach you properly how to swing the driver to get the most out of it.
Go ahead ask questions. Do you use the turned shoulder plane? What hinging do you use through impact? What kind of loading action do you use? What's your tempo like? Again, i could go on forever.
Some hit up and some hit down, however when most people think they are hitting up they are still really hitting down. It just "feels" up because your HEAD is so far BEHIND the ball and you have a TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF TILT. So if you are basically teeing up the ball at low point you are basically on the verge of hitting up and you "feel that." However i can position you in a way in your setup and ball position to really "hit up" and most people i do start hitting low snap hooks, hmmm......i wonder why?
They then do 3 things normally to hit the ball "decent."
1) The good players just angle hinge it and hit these monstrous "power fades"
2) Bad players will try start flipping at it or leaving the face wide open and they keep pulling or slicing the hell out of it
3) Some people start bending their plane line so far right they hit some REALLY BIG push draws.
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Hope this helps lol
Where you tee the ball, what shaft you are using, how stiff that shaft is, what hinging you use, how flat/arched/bent your wrist is, how much axis tilt you have, how much leakage through impact you have, where you're hitting it on the face, i could go on forever.
This all has a huge effect on fittings on this is why i can do it better than most because i understand how it all effects given launch conditions. Most fitters simply look at the numbers and do what the puter says to make you hit it farther. Sure maybe that gets you "on the right track" but i'm gonna be the one who can help fix your leakage, then fit you into the right gear, and then teach you properly how to swing the driver to get the most out of it.
Go ahead ask questions. Do you use the turned shoulder plane? What hinging do you use through impact? What kind of loading action do you use? What's your tempo like? Again, i could go on forever.
Some hit up and some hit down, however when most people think they are hitting up they are still really hitting down. It just "feels" up because your HEAD is so far BEHIND the ball and you have a TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF TILT. So if you are basically teeing up the ball at low point you are basically on the verge of hitting up and you "feel that." However i can position you in a way in your setup and ball position to really "hit up" and most people i do start hitting low snap hooks, hmmm......i wonder why?
They then do 3 things normally to hit the ball "decent."
1) The good players just angle hinge it and hit these monstrous "power fades"
2) Bad players will try start flipping at it or leaving the face wide open and they keep pulling or slicing the hell out of it
3) Some people start bending their plane line so far right they hit some REALLY BIG push draws.
--------
Hope this helps lol
birdie_man
New
Jim...
Are you saying that this is how Mobley would achieve a high enough launch angle?...
Someone said he couldn't get optimum numbers hitting down on an 8 degree driver or something....
...
But I thought that ideally the shaft should still be stressed some at Impact...? No?
birdie_man
New
Yes sir. Up until the right arm straightens....(both arms straight is Follow Through).....the right forearm is thrusting...
For Hitters it is actively being thrusted (with muscular force) out to right field.
With Swinging, it it being thrown out by Centrifugal Force (or Centripetal Force or w/e it is).
Either way you are creating force.....you are "thrusting," I guess.
birdie_man
New
Do you guys think that the hands can be moving up......and you can still have a Flat l. wrist?
...
Cause I keep looking at that pic of Bubba on the first page....
His hands are beyond the left shoulder (centre of the swing).......so, if Homer was right, and Brian was right in his Flipper video.....his hands should be moving up at that point......
.....and his l. wrist IS Flat....
...
I'm not even trying to debate what is better BTW!....cause I can just hear Brian:
"You SHOULD hit down!" [8D]
...
Cause I keep looking at that pic of Bubba on the first page....
His hands are beyond the left shoulder (centre of the swing).......so, if Homer was right, and Brian was right in his Flipper video.....his hands should be moving up at that point......
.....and his l. wrist IS Flat....
...
I'm not even trying to debate what is better BTW!....cause I can just hear Brian:
"You SHOULD hit down!" [8D]
palmreader
New
Birdie,
I agree with Burner, and there is no reason why one cannot maintain the flat left wrist throughout the swing. My argument all along was that you could not have club head going up while hands going down with flat left wrist, specially with a lagging club head. I know Jim had listed a numner of things why that is possible, but I am not knowledgeable to say "ye" or "ne"
I agree with Burner, and there is no reason why one cannot maintain the flat left wrist throughout the swing. My argument all along was that you could not have club head going up while hands going down with flat left wrist, specially with a lagging club head. I know Jim had listed a numner of things why that is possible, but I am not knowledgeable to say "ye" or "ne"
Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
Ok....let me first say that i do believe bubba hits up, on SOME of his drives. He has to, to create the launch conditions he gets.
BUT
Not always. Even in this swing sequence he is basically "at low point." Remember the left hand has to PASS the left shoulder to be going "up." It is still IN LINE with it. Look at it closer.
BUT
Not always
. Even in this swing sequence he is basically "at low point." Remember the left hand has to PASS the left shoulder to be going "up." It is still IN LINE with it. Look at it closer.Archie Swivel
New
I think the long drive dudes that hit the low degree drivers, 4-6 degrees, are hitting with the clubhead going up. The guys hitting the 7-10 degree drivers are not hitting up as much. I doubt Bubba uses less than an 8 degree driver on tour.
Depending on the loft of the driver, one may gain distance hitting up. I do not think you should hit up on a 3-wood even if your are teeing it up. I have discovered that its harder to be consistent hitting up. When I try to come in level, my launch angles vary only by a degree or two. But when I hit up, they may vary by 3 or 4 degrees.
Tour pros do not use the low lofted drivers. Plus they use the shorter drivers, not the 48 inchers. Finally, they want consistency in their ball flight and the ability shape their shot. Its harder to shape a big tall drive on purpose.
But this is based on my own lab results and not an independent study.
Depending on the loft of the driver, one may gain distance hitting up. I do not think you should hit up on a 3-wood even if your are teeing it up. I have discovered that its harder to be consistent hitting up. When I try to come in level, my launch angles vary only by a degree or two. But when I hit up, they may vary by 3 or 4 degrees.
Tour pros do not use the low lofted drivers. Plus they use the shorter drivers, not the 48 inchers. Finally, they want consistency in their ball flight and the ability shape their shot. Its harder to shape a big tall drive on purpose.
But this is based on my own lab results and not an independent study.
Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
Bubba has a measured 6.75* driver. JB has a 7.5* driver.
Phil M and VJ are not experimenting and have used in tournaments a 47" overall driver length.
It's all about distance now
Phil M and VJ are not experimenting and have used in tournaments a 47" overall driver length.
It's all about distance now
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