Don't know if this helps but I had to upgrade my Qtime and then it played.
Continued Research ...ISRAD
- Thread starter Brian Manzella
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Don't know if this helps but I had to upgrade my Qtime and then it played.
Bill Miracle
New
Thanks Spike but...
I tried that. It says I have an up to date version. Mine is version 6.5
I tried that. It says I have an up to date version. Mine is version 6.5
Brian Manzella
Administrator
Don't worry...
The BOX is still there, and you STILL HIT THE BOX.
Video coming....
The BOX is still there, and you STILL HIT THE BOX.
Video coming....
Bill Miracle
New
Got it fixed...
went to the site and there is a new version.
went to the site and there is a new version.
Looks great
Brian,
In your new swing it looks like you're letting the club seek a inline condition with your right arm while your left arm simply does the hinging through impact, thus the club snaps inline with the right arm just after seperation and very early in the finish swivel. This creates a two stage flail. The swingle first catches up with the left arm (stage one) then overtakes it as it seeks to achive an inline condition with the right arm (stage two). The right hand must be moving faster than the left to avoid swingle deceleration. Very nice action.
Brian,
In your new swing it looks like you're letting the club seek a inline condition with your right arm while your left arm simply does the hinging through impact, thus the club snaps inline with the right arm just after seperation and very early in the finish swivel. This creates a two stage flail. The swingle first catches up with the left arm (stage one) then overtakes it as it seeks to achive an inline condition with the right arm (stage two). The right hand must be moving faster than the left to avoid swingle deceleration. Very nice action.
shortgamer
New
Okay for the first time in my life I tried pure swinging and I did gain some distance and got back that solid feel at impact. Always been a hitter/switter. I just thought about pulling with the left hand to aiming point. Any other tips?
The Tale of the Flails
Law of the flail-- out of line to inline achieves maximum velocity, past inline condition results in deceleration.
Flail 1, construct-- pivot/left arm/club; action-- provides throw-out action of club toward base of plane line; initiation from the top of swing to the point where the shaft is parallel to the plane line; terminal velocity @ separation.
Flail 2, construct; right arm/toe of club, action; provides downward action to low point; initiation at the end of the secondary axis tilt when the shaft is parallel to the base of the plane line; terminal velocity @ right arm/club shaft alignment thus commencing the finish swivel.
Equivalents, Flail 1 = left arm flying wedge.
Equivalents, Flail 2 = right arm flying wedge.
Law of the flail-- out of line to inline achieves maximum velocity, past inline condition results in deceleration.
Flail 1, construct-- pivot/left arm/club; action-- provides throw-out action of club toward base of plane line; initiation from the top of swing to the point where the shaft is parallel to the plane line; terminal velocity @ separation.
Flail 2, construct; right arm/toe of club, action; provides downward action to low point; initiation at the end of the secondary axis tilt when the shaft is parallel to the base of the plane line; terminal velocity @ right arm/club shaft alignment thus commencing the finish swivel.
Equivalents, Flail 1 = left arm flying wedge.
Equivalents, Flail 2 = right arm flying wedge.
birdie_man
New
Hey Brian you pure-Swinging EVERYTHING??
What about when u need more forward lean? (hit it lower)
What about when u need more forward lean? (hit it lower)
Tiger Motion
Tobell
If you go to http://www.nike.com/nikegolf/swingportrait/index.html
and click on the podcast you can download what they call a side view. I would call it an up the line view. You can really appreciate what Tiger's right hand does through impact and separation. Is this an example of a dual flail movement? In your opinion. In one frame it actually looks as though the clubhead is has passed the ball. The clubhead looks like it puts a shadow on the ball after separation.
What say you Brian?
BTW If you replay the clip in 3x (A/V Control) it gives a closer representation of a real time motion.
PChandler
Tobell
If you go to http://www.nike.com/nikegolf/swingportrait/index.html
and click on the podcast you can download what they call a side view. I would call it an up the line view. You can really appreciate what Tiger's right hand does through impact and separation. Is this an example of a dual flail movement? In your opinion. In one frame it actually looks as though the clubhead is has passed the ball. The clubhead looks like it puts a shadow on the ball after separation.
What say you Brian?
BTW If you replay the clip in 3x (A/V Control) it gives a closer representation of a real time motion.
PChandler
self-mastery
New
A few months ago you said that "PURE SWINGING" isn't for most people, but you failed to give a reason WHY. Why was "pure swinging" a bastard child months ago, but first born today?
birdie_man
New
I was thinking that too...I remember that quote...and also in the Mike Austin analysis where he said you'll have more SPEED with a Bending left wrist/Flattening right. (he said if you wanted to whip something with a STICK you'd Flatten the right wrist)
...
So ya...
My guess is cause (as it's been said)...
....pure Swings (like the PING man with the free "wrist hinge") will move towards a Bent left wrist thru Impact...
(BTW I know Brian has said this somewhere before too)
.....and.....this mostly is not good for anyone who's learning to not flip it.
Those people need to learn the opposite.
...
AND....before all "THIS" came about (with mandrin...and Brian's increased SS and distance...etc.) basically the idea around here (but not just in here) was that you could "add mass" to Impact (with an Arched left wrist for structure)...
....and that a 4B Swing allowed you to do that better and was:
-longer most of the time (one more Power Accumulator, a later Release, + the goal of an Arched left wrist at Impact....with the shaft more "up the left arm" past Impact...)
-NOT moving towards Throwaway
...
So basically structure was THE goal (with speed too of course)....whereas now there seems to have been a shift at least to structure having decreased importance.
...
So ya...
My guess is cause (as it's been said)...
....pure Swings (like the PING man with the free "wrist hinge") will move towards a Bent left wrist thru Impact...
(BTW I know Brian has said this somewhere before too)
.....and.....this mostly is not good for anyone who's learning to not flip it.
Those people need to learn the opposite.
...
AND....before all "THIS" came about (with mandrin...and Brian's increased SS and distance...etc.) basically the idea around here (but not just in here) was that you could "add mass" to Impact (with an Arched left wrist for structure)...
....and that a 4B Swing allowed you to do that better and was:
-longer most of the time (one more Power Accumulator, a later Release, + the goal of an Arched left wrist at Impact....with the shaft more "up the left arm" past Impact...)
-NOT moving towards Throwaway
...
So basically structure was THE goal (with speed too of course)....whereas now there seems to have been a shift at least to structure having decreased importance.
Last edited:
shootin4par
New
so then if a bent left wrist is good just past seperation then does that mean it should be flat or bent at the top of the backswing?
Brian Manzella
Administrator
If that is class, that's cool, because...
..I have always admitted when I was wrong, half-right, or "incomplete."
"I'll learn what they know, and whatever anyone else I can find who knows something does. And, I'll come up with a bunch of stuff myself as well. But they will never learn from me—so they'll never catch me." —Brian Manzella to Joe Daniels and Danny Elkins, January 2004
When I went to see Ben in 1987, I had become a very good player. I had come up with my own teaching system—Absolute Golf—and I taught it to myself. Tommy Moore, the late PGA Tour player and pal of ours, couldn't belive how good I had gotten. I very nearly qualified for the second stage of the US Open and for the PGA Tour New Orleans Open in 1984 & 1985, paired with Tommy in a couple of those rounds.
I was booked solid, charging more per hour than anyone in New Orleans history. I was my own boss, and was the best athlete in the firls in 90% of every tournament I played in.
But...I wasn't satisfied.
So I went to see Ben and absolutely was even better a player and teacher as a result.
Ben taught me to allow the right wrist to bend... after the follow-through.
This is what I taught to all for years...except to the players who COULDN'T DO IT, but could STILL play great. Like David Toms.
They were "pure swingers" ala Ernest Jones.
Now, what is silly is that Ernest Jones' theories were a large part of what we would call "ZONE 2" in Absoulte Golf.
Jones basically says NO LEVERAGING!! Or in english, no PUSHING on the shaft...pulling only!
Obviously, this is what David was doing, and I allowed it because he hit is BETTER IN EVERY WAY doing this. David did get more of a snap release when we worked full-time together, and a flatter left wrist at impact. But his left wrist DID NOT stay flat to the follow-through. Now (of course) I know it shouldn't, because he is nearly a "pure swinger."
When I figured out the Never Hook Again pattern, it FEATURED a non-arched left wrist at impact, I felt like it was "soft-impact." I would have shot in the mid-60's every round if I didn't accidentally ADD some "hitting" under pressure.
It took MANY MOONS for me to completely develop the current "Nevder Hook Again" pattern/method. It is certainly NOT "pure-swinging."
But it works, and it can be adjusted to do ALMOST any other pattern easily.
I ain't giving it all away here..so...I'll shhhhhh...but...
The point to all of this is simple:
90% of every player who ever won a major, uses this "Flail"-type left wrist /right wrist action.
To many TGMers are always WAY TOO BUSY saying, "Well if they did it right...they'd be even better"!
They are the BEST PLAYERS in the WORLD and the BEST of ALL-Time!!
It still hurt my feeling that Chris DiMarco can give me 15-30 shots for 72 holes.
He won't for long.
(relax Manzella-ites and TGM-ers , you STILL HAVE TO HIT THE BOX!!!)
..I have always admitted when I was wrong, half-right, or "incomplete."
"I'll learn what they know, and whatever anyone else I can find who knows something does. And, I'll come up with a bunch of stuff myself as well. But they will never learn from me—so they'll never catch me." —Brian Manzella to Joe Daniels and Danny Elkins, January 2004
When I went to see Ben in 1987, I had become a very good player. I had come up with my own teaching system—Absolute Golf—and I taught it to myself. Tommy Moore, the late PGA Tour player and pal of ours, couldn't belive how good I had gotten. I very nearly qualified for the second stage of the US Open and for the PGA Tour New Orleans Open in 1984 & 1985, paired with Tommy in a couple of those rounds.
I was booked solid, charging more per hour than anyone in New Orleans history. I was my own boss, and was the best athlete in the firls in 90% of every tournament I played in.
But...I wasn't satisfied.
So I went to see Ben and absolutely was even better a player and teacher as a result.
Ben taught me to allow the right wrist to bend... after the follow-through.
This is what I taught to all for years...except to the players who COULDN'T DO IT, but could STILL play great. Like David Toms.
They were "pure swingers" ala Ernest Jones.
Now, what is silly is that Ernest Jones' theories were a large part of what we would call "ZONE 2" in Absoulte Golf.
Jones basically says NO LEVERAGING!! Or in english, no PUSHING on the shaft...pulling only!
Obviously, this is what David was doing, and I allowed it because he hit is BETTER IN EVERY WAY doing this. David did get more of a snap release when we worked full-time together, and a flatter left wrist at impact. But his left wrist DID NOT stay flat to the follow-through. Now (of course) I know it shouldn't, because he is nearly a "pure swinger."
When I figured out the Never Hook Again pattern, it FEATURED a non-arched left wrist at impact, I felt like it was "soft-impact." I would have shot in the mid-60's every round if I didn't accidentally ADD some "hitting" under pressure.
It took MANY MOONS for me to completely develop the current "Nevder Hook Again" pattern/method. It is certainly NOT "pure-swinging."
But it works, and it can be adjusted to do ALMOST any other pattern easily.
I ain't giving it all away here..so...I'll shhhhhh...but...The point to all of this is simple:
90% of every player who ever won a major, uses this "Flail"-type left wrist /right wrist action.
To many TGMers are always WAY TOO BUSY saying, "Well if they did it right...they'd be even better"!
They are the BEST PLAYERS in the WORLD and the BEST of ALL-Time!!
It still hurt my feeling that Chris DiMarco can give me 15-30 shots for 72 holes.
He won't for long.
(relax Manzella-ites and TGM-ers
, you STILL HAVE TO HIT THE BOX!!!)
birdie_man
New
You just hit it with more speed now?
(the box)
(the box)
birdie_man
New
Hey Burner Real Player should do QT.
shortgamer
New
There's some interesting talk of Brians change in "The secret of golf" in gea right now. On a side note I think this "don't let the right wrist straighten" stuff started to make me "hold on" and not let it go at the bottom which led me to hit the ball thin and on the toe. I swung in the yard this morning thinking about straightening the right wrist AFTER impact and it felt like an old friend came back to see me. Maybe some scratch golf is back on the horizon. Yeah Hoo!
Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
There's a difference between allowing the left wrist to bend sooner and the right wrist to flatten and having a completely bent left wrist and no swivel.
Like Brian said earlier, if you are having problems flipping the ball this may not be for you. Even those great players who let their left wrists bend after impact don't to it until somewhere after the both arms straight position. There is still some kind of swivel with a relatively flat left wrist and THEN it bends.
Like Brian said earlier, if you are having problems flipping the ball this may not be for you. Even those great players who let their left wrists bend after impact don't to it until somewhere after the both arms straight position. There is still some kind of swivel with a relatively flat left wrist and THEN it bends.
Brian Manzella
Administrator
The "Fiddle Drill" is an example of a "Pure swing."
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