Is Lag from the left shoulder through impact possible?

[Brian Manzella]

POINT #1 :

NOTHING TO BE GAINED FROM "stretching" the shaft.

 

[footwedge]

Absolutely, I understand the "if's". BerntR just seems to be advocating the turning of only the shoulders (mostly the left shoulder) to increase speed through the increase of axial force to the club at the risk of dismissing other very important factors in the swing. If the sole focus is on the shoulder turn, then it makes it more likely to be overdone as Brian illustrated in his quote. My point is minor and really has nothing to do with BerntR's original question which I think I now have a better understanding of what he is asking and a general idea as to the answer--I will let the researchers give the definitive answer, though.

Anything can be over done if you keep "consciously trying".

 

[dbl]

I find this thread interesting, not only from a scientific viewpoint, but also from a behavioural one.

My hypothesis: (snip)

The point: how much science is tainted by predetermined outcome wishes. Is objectivity really possible?

MikeO seems to have concerned himself with the workings of the brain. Any comments Mikey?

Great post Wulsy. While not sure of the speculations, but the overall point you raised about predetermined outcomes, is huge. How we divine reality will affect our answers. We are all stuck with some frameworks of understanding and rarely get glimpses of other ways to view things, or at least rarely accept.

 

[wulsy]

POINT #1 :

NOTHING TO BE GAINED FROM "stretching" the shaft.

I love this straight-talkin...

 

[magicmarker]

if your only goal is to create some speed, it would seem there are a number of ways to do so, with turning shoulders being one method.

shouldn't the goal be to create the OPTIMUM SPEED while still controlling the path and face.

it seems your hypotheses rely on a ball position that would be considered 'back' in your stance IMO

 

[Dariusz J.]

POINT #1 :

NOTHING TO BE GAINED FROM "stretching" the shaft.

Of course. If it had been otherwise neither Hogan nor Moe would have used telephone poles as their shafts. Noone thought about it, yes ?

Cheers

 

[BerntR]

This isn't about stroke pattern. This is about understanding some of the physics involved in basically any sound golf stroke.

The axial force in the shaft is strictly normal force only if the shaft points towards the swing center. It is a composite of normal and tangential force if the shaft points towards a moving left shoulder. And wherever there's a tangential force, there's a change of swing speed.

I hope everyone who read wulsy's very blunt attack on my credibility above realizes that it was pure speculation and as such, more telling about his own state of mind than anything else.

 

[Mike O]

MikeO seems to have concerned himself with the workings of the brain. Any comments Mikey?

Nurse Ratchet has adjusted my medications - their putting me up in "D" Block - not sure when they'll let me out again.

 

[wulsy]

Look forward to meeting up for a cup of tea then.

 

[wulsy]

if your only goal is to create some speed, it would seem there are a number of ways to do so, with turning shoulders being one method.

shouldn't the goal be to create the OPTIMUM SPEED while still controlling the path and face.

it seems your hypotheses rely on a ball position that would be considered 'back' in your stance IMO

Good point.

 

[blehnhard]

If you're a golfer, they put you in the "D Plane" block

 

[wulsy]

This isn't about stroke pattern. This is about understanding some of the physics involved in basically any sound golf stroke.

The axial force in the shaft is strictly normal force only if the shaft points towards the swing center. It is a composite of normal and tangential force if the shaft points towards a moving left shoulder. And wherever there's a tangential force, there's a change of swing speed.

I hope everyone who read wulsy's very blunt attack on my credibility above realizes that it was pure speculation and as such, more telling about his own state of mind than anything else.

It was anything but an attack. It was a HYPOTHESIS, and I said that from the onset. Are you becoming less scientific?

And it is very rude to talk about people's "state of mind" who you have never met, and about whom you know nothing.

You should try to become a little less vain and stop harping on about your qualifications and credibility. Credibility? What credibility? You are, by your own definitions, a hobby student of the golf swing, nothing more, nothing less. What you express here is your opinion based on some "degree" level understanding of physics and forces. No-one's allowed to comment on your posts unless they agree? Come on, bro, get real.

 

[BerntR]

POINT #1 :

NOTHING TO BE GAINED FROM "stretching" the shaft.

I would like to hear Miyra's comment on that one.

 

[drewyallop]

It was anything but an attack. It was a HYPOTHESIS, and I said that from the onset. Are you becoming less scientific?

And it is very rude to talk about people's "state of mind" who you have never met, and about whom you know nothing.

You should try to become a little less vain and stop harping on about your qualifications and credibility. Credibility? What credibility? You are, by your own definitions, a hobby student of the golf swing, nothing more, nothing less. What you express here is your opinion based on some "degree" level understanding of physics and forces. No-one's allowed to comment on your posts unless they agree? Come on, bro, get real.

Bernt offerings.

 

[BerntR]

if your only goal is to create some speed, it would seem there are a number of ways to do so, with turning shoulders being one method.

shouldn't the goal be to create the OPTIMUM SPEED while still controlling the path and face.

it seems your hypotheses rely on a ball position that would be considered 'back' in your stance IMO

I agree with the two first sentences here.

As far as the third sentence goes: I don't think a ball back position is generally a good idea - and I guess you don't think so either.

In any case I never intended this discussion to be a how-to discussion. The focus is about understanding the physics of the pulling from the left.