POLL - Anchoring putters to the body

[ZAP]

This is the last post I expected to see on here. But I have to say that while working on the stuff Brian told me about my putting stroke I had a strange sensation and it felt a lot like when I was playing a little "putt" with my 3 wood from off the green and the top of the grip got caught in my shirt and it made the 3 wood "release". I hit a really good shot which kind of scared me. Since then I have been practicing using my 3 wood as a belly putter and transferring those feels to my regular putting stroke. The results have been good.

I ain't mad at ya.

 

[Kevin Shields]

It's not a tickling competition, those lads are trying to hurt you.

Belly putting is not the fringe anymore so I wouldn't worry about the angry texts while you stuff your pockets with cashe!

 

[Lindsey Newman]

This is the last post I expected to see on here. But I have to say that while working on the stuff Brian told me about my putting stroke I had a strange sensation and it felt a lot like when I was playing a little "putt" with my 3 wood from off the green and the top of the grip got caught in my shirt and it made the 3 wood "release". I hit a really good shot which kind of scared me. Since then I have been practicing using my 3 wood as a belly putter and transferring those feels to my regular putting stroke. The results have been good.

I ain't mad at ya.

So nice watching a solid released putt roll end over end.

 

[ZAP]

True dat! What amazes me is how easy it is to control distance. Almost exactly like rolling a ball underhand.

 

[earthshine2k]

Doesn't bother me either way. There's nothing in the record books that suggest it creates a fundamental advantage. If it did, stigma be damned, guys would flock to it. IMO, there are many critical factors in becoming a good putter before the putter is ever pulled back. The tool and method are just the easiest to see on TV.

Hey, mgranato. How do you like me, now? 3 of the last 4 Major champions wielding long putters. With the most recent runner up wielding one, too. And, Adam Scott, by his own admission, revived his career by switching to the long putter. At the very least, the long putter has given him a severe confidence boots. Ernie Els couldn't hit water if he fell out of a boat w/ a conventional putter. But, nah, there's nothing to suggest the anchored putter provides ANY advantage. Mechanical or otherwise.

 

[Ryan Smither]

The questions that continue to beg for answers: Is "anchoring" the putter optimal? If so, why?

Here is one man's perspective (from a few years back):

"What are your thoughts on 'long putters'?

Geoff Mangum: I have seen some golfers use long putters with great skill and effectiveness, and that makes me want to understand what is going on in the targeting and stroke movement processes that is different from those involved with conventional putting style. On the one hand, I agree with Arnold Palmer that golf needs to be fun for the amateur, and equipment that promotes success for the amateur should be allowed with only modest restrictions on gimmickry. On the other hand, I'm also a traditionalist when it comes to competitive golf, so I tend to agree with Ernie Els and others that equipment-based differences that make the human task substantially different between competitors should be disallowed. If at the professional level at least the consensus arises that long putters in comparison to conventional putters involves a significant unfair advantage, then either everyone should use them or no one should use them.

But I don't think long putters really present a significant advantage just from the nature of the design or the technique of use. Sure, some golfers benefit from switching to a long putter or a belly putter, but this doesn't mean a golfer with a conventional putter needs to switch in order to outperform those with long putters - clearly, golfers using conventional putters typically outperform those using the long or belly putter. The take-away lesson from Vijay Singh's magnificent year in 2004 is that using the belly putter is a very good way to learn how to get better with a conventional putter."

Putting guru Geoff Mangum on the nuances of golf's most crucial shot - GolfInstruction.com

 

[Keefer]

Didin't read the whole thread so it may have been mentioned before, but bifurcation is the answer IMO. Golf is so hard that anything that can make the game easier and more enjoyable for the average hacker is a good idea IMO.

 

[mgranato]

Hey, mgranato. How do you like me, now? 3 of the last 4 Major champions wielding long putters. With the most recent runner up wielding one, too. And, Adam Scott, by his own admission, revived his career by switching to the long putter. At the very least, the long putter has given him a severe confidence boots. Ernie Els couldn't hit water if he fell out of a boat w/ a conventional putter. But, nah, there's nothing to suggest the anchored putter provides ANY advantage. Mechanical or otherwise.

So let me make sure I follow...

3 winners in the history of golf presents evidence of a fundamental advantage?

You have to first suck at putting to see the true advantage?

Taking a bad putter to the lofts of mediocre putter is cause for alarm?

Was it a Who or a What that Ernie credited for his return to form?

Each player should use whatever legal club they want that helps them putt their best - what's the problem?

 

[faux_maestro]

I definitely will use the same belly technique if I go back to traditional. No more shoulders rocking and blocking

Lindsey,

What specific technique/stroke changes have you employed using the belly putter?

 

[Lindsey Newman]

Lindsey,

What specific technique/stroke changes have you employed using the belly putter?

Before I took the "deep dive" on belly technique, I kept hearing how it takes the wrists and hands out of the equation. That is completely false! It actually promotes more hand and wrist activity as well as elbow hinging movement. If you watch the best belly putters, you'll see very static shoulders. I believe that using the shoulders with belly putter makes zero sense. You want the anchored position to stay perfectly still otherwise you're defeating the whole purpose. The best thing about a belly is that it warrants exactness of setup and exactness of shaft and face alignment.

I set up with the Anchor about one inch target side of my belly button, grip with my normal grip. Ball is just forward of center so I have the tiniest bit of forward lean on the shaft. The ball is located directly below my left eye with my weight favoring my left foot.

The stroke is simply a hinginging back of my right wrist and elbow and then I reverse the process through the ball in what feels like a shoving action. Then my left wrist bends past impact and my left elbow folds. My shoulder are only RESPONDING to these movements.

If you're familiar at all with the Utley type of stroke then you'll have an idea of what I'm trying to accomplish with the belly. I will say that I go back and forth between belly and conventional, but I use the same technique either way. I think the belly has helped my get out of the rock and block stroke ie "straight back, straight through" Pelz style move.

 

[Tball88]

what Lindsay is saying is exactly why I couldn't use a belly putter. The benefits are that it does encourage a very nice release, however, for me I thought it made me more hands and wristy and I went back to a standard putter so that I could just use a shoulder motion.

I personally don't think it's that much of an advantage, works for some people, but for many is no help at all and may make them worse.

 

[Brian Manzella]

To me Webb Simpson is the best long putter putter.

Left shoulder UP!

 

[dlam]

I started using a broomstick putter this year and I find the game less frustrating
I hope the sternum style is continued to be allowed

 

[btp]

I've used the belly putter for about a year. Advantages are straight putts and short putts. With it anchored, I lose some feel. I putt consistent on longer putts, but don't seem to get the perfect speed as often as I did with a short putter.
Hit it on the right line at the right speed and it usually goes in. That's the same no matter what size putter you use. I see no advantage to the long putter. A definite advantage on some putts with the belly putter. A definite advantage on some putts with the short putter. I should drop a wedge and carry two putters.

 

[Lindsey Newman]

To me Webb Simpson is the best long putter putter.

Left shoulder UP!

I know he (Simpson) says he uses his shoulders to stroke it, but I see a lot more than that going on. He is also lead hand low which may alter things a little. To me it just does not make sense to have 2 axis of rotation. One at the anchor point and then another in the shoulder complex.

 

[fronesis]

My thoughts:

1. I'm in favor of keeping the long putters (belly and sternum) legal, for a variety of reasons: a) they have a much smaller impact on the game than driver and ball technology has had, b) you can still lose your nerves and putt horribly with them, and c) they've been legal for a good long while now and lots of younger players have played most of their life with them – seems unfair to change the game so radically on folks like those, e.g. a senior in college who is a top Division I player who has played throughout high school and college with a long putter.

2. I putted for 20+ years traditionally, and since then I've done 1 year with a belly putter and one year with a long sternum putter. From that, I think Lindsey is exactly right. Folks often talk about the belly putter taking the hands out, but the belly putter is NOT a shoulders stroke. You anchor the top of the club and swing the bottom with hands and arms. VERY different stroke from the broomstick.

3. I putt much better with the sternum putter, especially to the extent that I can work on hitting better putts and really putt with my shoulders for the first time. But I'm still not a great putter...

 

[faux_maestro]

Before I took the "deep dive" on belly technique, I kept hearing how it takes the wrists and hands out of the equation. That is completely false! It actually promotes more hand and wrist activity as well as elbow hinging movement. If you watch the best belly putters, you'll see very static shoulders. I believe that using the shoulders with belly putter makes zero sense. You want the anchored position to stay perfectly still otherwise you're defeating the whole purpose. The best thing about a belly is that it warrants exactness of setup and exactness of shaft and face alignment.

I set up with the Anchor about one inch target side of my belly button, grip with my normal grip. Ball is just forward of center so I have the tiniest bit of forward lean on the shaft. The ball is located directly below my left eye with my weight favoring my left foot.

The stroke is simply a hinginging back of my right wrist and elbow and then I reverse the process through the ball in what feels like a shoving action. Then my left wrist bends past impact and my left elbow folds. My shoulder are only RESPONDING to these movements.

If you're familiar at all with the Utley type of stroke then you'll have an idea of what I'm trying to accomplish with the belly. I will say that I go back and forth between belly and conventional, but I use the same technique either way. I think the belly has helped my get out of the rock and block stroke ie "straight back, straight through" Pelz style move.

I am familiar with Utley and what you describe is what I've noticed in my fooling around with the belly putter. I have fooled around with some belly putters but can't really get comfortable, I'm 5'10" and have a bit too much belly though it is shrinking. I'm too far away from the ball and most putters are too long and the grip just doesn't work at the angle the club creates. The thing I need to do is actually get a good fitting and see what happens I guess.Thanks for the info.

 

[dlam]

At my local club the head pro feels the okay with allowing long putter, the assistant pro is emotional against it.

I didnt want to get into a heat topic with him but it goes back to this anchoring issue and not so much about the long putter

I thinking a short putter can also be "anchored" but it looks like conventional putting.
For example, why isn't holding the hands against the front thigh with a short putter anchoring? OR why wouldnt just touching the elbows against the belly throught out the stroke with a short putter be considered anchoring?

 

[faux_maestro]

At my local club the head pro feels the okay with allowing long putter, the assistant pro is emotional against it.

I didnt want to get into a heat topic with him but it goes back to this anchoring issue and not so much about the long putter

I thinking a short putter can also be "anchored" but it looks like conventional putting.
For example, why isn't holding the hands against the front thigh with a short putter anchoring? OR why wouldnt just touching the elbows against the belly throught out the stroke with a short putter be considered anchoring?

I guess the point is the act of attaching the butt of the grip into the belly or chest. I feel like it should have been banned many years ago but I'm kinda torn now. I mean there are guys on tour now have putted with a belly for most of their lives. I think it might be unfair to ban them now. The bigger problem to me was the ball and they seem to have ignored that.

 

[Virtuoso]

I know he (Simpson) says he uses his shoulders to stroke it, but I see a lot more than that going on. He is also lead hand low which may alter things a little. To me it just does not make sense to have 2 axis of rotation. One at the anchor point and then another in the shoulder complex.

Nailed it. My experience when letting a pro or amatuer try a belly for the first time: if they, by chance, happen to use the anchor point as the only (or at least primary fulcrum) they imediately feel "comfortable" with it. If they get the shoulders moving also, and independently of the anchor point as oppossed to "slightly responding", they hate it....especially if they have their grip too low and arms too extended. That really gets a serious and awkward double pendelum see-saw effect happening.