Pros/Cons of a cupped left wrist at the top

[dbl]

JH, I saw in another thread you mention irvine, and showing a socal range (costa mesa?), and I'm from this same region too.

When you write that it is hard to hit fades with a FLW, I think you need to consider your writing style, as that is not really a general statement but one speaking out of your own particular difficulties or pattern you have. To me, I think Sturgess' point is quite correct. But if a person uses a cupped wrist and then holds off the flattening, that is another kettle of fish. Personally I think that is a tough way to guarantee a fade and more orthodox choices might be available to you as your pattern gets more orthodox.

 

[tongzilla]

you can have a flat left wrist without twistaway, which will produce more of a push shot.

 

[pecky987]

it simple geometry guys

no matter what your grip is like, and no matter what plane your on at the top, if you cup your wrist it will be MORE OPEN then if it was flat.

end off

 

[Tball88]

I think the point made that lower handicappers may like this to add to release makes a lot of sense. Not sure I'm considered a low handicapper at a 6.0 index, however, when I cup the wrist, I feel like I can let loose on the downswing without fear of going left. However, with a flat left wrist at the top, sometimes I feel like I have to hold off my finish for fear of going left.

Trust me though, I can also hook with a cupped wrist, especially if I hang back on the right side, I'll get some strong face hooks and pulls.

 

[pecky987]

I think the point made that lower handicappers may like this to add to release makes a lot of sense. Not sure I'm considered a low handicapper at a 6.0 index, however, when I cup the wrist, I feel like I can let loose on the downswing without fear of going left. However, with a flat left wrist at the top, sometimes I feel like I have to hold off my finish for fear of going left.

Trust me though, I can also hook with a cupped wrist, especially if I hang back on the right side, I'll get some strong face hooks and pulls.

going back to my point, if you can hit the ball left, cupping the wrist will OPEN the face more, and this may cure your problem.

for the majority of players who hve the face too open, cupping will only open it more. that isnt a good thing

 

[Chris Sturgess]

Pecky, instead of repeating yourself try actually listening to what other people are saying. We're going more in depth than what you are repeating.

 

[puttmad]

Guys, guys,

A cupped left wrist at the top only affects the clubface if it remains that way on the downswing....

Get out your photos etc and take a close look at what happens generally on the downswing....

In most of the players I have been able to study, the wrist becomes flat about half way down, as the lag begins to open....this negates all the open and closed clubface stuff......

The clubface position is only relevant if your hold the cupped position all the way down and thro impact (where you would say, "It looks like you are flipping".....>))

Re-read my earlier post.....

 

[Chris Sturgess]

Apparently the English guys are already throwing back the ale in preparation for the Ryder Cup because Puttmad and Pecky's reading comprehension is very foggy here.

 

[Kevin Shields]

going back to my point, if you can hit the ball left, cupping the wrist will OPEN the face more, and this may cure your problem.

for the majority of players who hve the face too open, cupping will only open it more. that isnt a good thing

Cupping the wrist does not open the face, period.

 

[Kevin Shields]

Guys, guys,

A cupped left wrist at the top only affects the clubface if it remains that way on the downswing....

Get out your photos etc and take a close look at what happens generally on the downswing....

In most of the players I have been able to study, the wrist becomes flat about half way down, as the lag begins to open....this negates all the open and closed clubface stuff......

The clubface position is only relevant if your hold the cupped position all the way down and thro impact (where you would say, "It looks like you are flipping".....>))

Re-read my earlier post.....

Exactly. A cupped position closes the face. Then a good downswing flattens the wrist and opens the face. That's why a cupped wrist can sometimes aid in curing a hook. But some people maintain the cup, add a little throwaway and pull hook it.

 

[Kevin Shields]

I think the point made that lower handicappers may like this to add to release makes a lot of sense. Not sure I'm considered a low handicapper at a 6.0 index, however, when I cup the wrist, I feel like I can let loose on the downswing without fear of going left. However, with a flat left wrist at the top, sometimes I feel like I have to hold off my finish for fear of going left.

Trust me though, I can also hook with a cupped wrist, especially if I hang back on the right side, I'll get some strong face hooks and pulls.

You have to hold it off because a flat or arched wrist opens the face. You have to release hard to square it, thus the feeling of hanging on not to hook it.

 

[pecky987]

Cupping the wrist does not open the face, period.

Exactly. A cupped position closes the face. Then a good downswing flattens the wrist and opens the face. That's why a cupped wrist can sometimes aid in curing a hook. But some people maintain the cup, add a little throwaway and pull hook it.

im sorry kevin, but i disagree.

at the the top of the swing, a cupped left wrist will have the face openmore then if it was flat.

at the bottom near impact, the result usually is different. a bent left wrist tends to close the face at impact and a flat or arched left wrist tends to open the face more. thats why in NSA brian uses "hitting the box" as a method of stopping you leakage hooking.

all im saying is depending on your pattern and your ball flight should be the only thing that effects the decision on whether or not the left wrist should be flat or cupped at the top

 

[Dariusz J.]

And I say, that relative to the swing arc, it does not matter if the face of the club points at the sky (bowed lead wrist at the top) or points to the front of us (cupped lead wrist at the top) - the face is always open because it is not possible for a human to keep it square to the arc all the time through all the backswing.
Technically and theoretically, we can only talk in the category of adding or diminishing loft of the clubface in case of cupped/flat/bowed left wrist at the top. IMHO.

Cheers

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

You are all making this way too difficult:

1) The face opens in the backswing no matter what you do because of forearm rotation
2) The face can be opened more by bending/cupping the left wrist in some fashion in the backswing

1+2 are the main reasons why there are a billion slicers on the planet and why NSA with twistaway was developed

Better players can get away with 1 and 2 above because they have more clubface control than the average golfer and can figure out how to let the club square itself up or are just really good flippers or maybe they use it as a defense against a hook.

 

[Tball88]

Jim, not sure I understand the flip comment. When I cup on the backswing, it forces me to move it to flat on the downswing. It actually is a very good move to avoid flipping, however, as you state you do need to have good clubface control.

 

[Tball88]

Actually now that I think about it, you can't flip with a cupped wrist. It's already flipped

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

Actually now that I think about it, you can't flip with a cupped wrist. It's already flipped

not true...if you don't do as you say you do (go from cupped to flat) you are going to have a very open clubface at impact and worse players will flip to square it instead of flattening and rotating

 

[Kevin Shields]

not true...if you don't do as you say you do (go from cupped to flat) you are going to have a very open clubface at impact and worse players will flip to square it instead of flattening and rotating

You will not open it. You will add loft. As you go from cupped to flat, you deloft and open the face. I dont care how much or how little you rotate your arm. I dont know how you cant see that.

 

[holeout]

You will not open it. You will add loft. As you go from cupped to flat, you deloft and open the face. I dont care how much or how little you rotate your arm. I dont know how you cant see that.

Posing at impact with a flat left wrist:

If you cup or bend, you will add loft without opening it only if you rotate your forearm counter-clockwise.

If you arch, you will deloft without closing it only if you rotate your forearm clockwise.

Right?

Brian?

 

[Dariusz J.]

You are all making this way too difficult:

1) The face opens in the backswing no matter what you do because of forearm rotation
2) The face can be opened more by bending/cupping the left wrist in some fashion in the backswing

OK, Jim. Physical model. Let's say when talking about openess or closeness of the clubface we are talking about its openess or closeness IN RELATION TO THE SWING ARC.
Now, no matter if one has a cupped or bowed left wrist at the top, the clubface is, in a model scenario, always open the same 90* in relation to the arc due to the forearm turn in the second phase of the backswing.
What is different is not the amount of openess, but the angle of the clubface, say, in relation to the ground which can be associated with the change in loft, not in openess.

...or I am missing something


Cheers