Ryder Cup

[rogerdodger]

It used to be an exhibition but it has grown to a lot more due to the importance placed on the event by both sides. The PGA and the Euros all wanted the Ryder Cup to be a big deal and now it is. I still remember when Weiskopf turned down a spot in 1977 to go hunting. Now it is a stand alone major event, if you base it on media attention and money. The U.S. simply played like they were afraid to lose on Sunday. Stricker, Furyk, Woods and Mickelson all lost, which doomed the U.S. Love should have had the young guys in front, they were playing better than the vets by a long shot. Tiger went through the motions with the fist pumps, but lost to Molinari, a guy that has never come close to winning a major championship. Stricker lost to Kaymer, who has stunk it up since winning the PGA two years ago. Furyk has lost the grittiness he used to exhibit on Sundays. I think Love knew if the young guys who had been playing great lost early, the U.S. was in big trouble. When Bradley lost, somehow you knew it was done. Golf swing related, does anyone on tour shank the ball more than Webb Simpson?

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

Golf swing related, does anyone on tour shank the ball more than Webb Simpson?

Major winner or not....first rule of Captaining no one who says "i shank it every so often in events" is allowed on my team lol.

 

[conkanen]

The big guns on the Euro team still cant win a major and that's really the only thing that matters. They can win an exhibition but Donald, Poulter and Garcia can't get it done in the real big ones.

Yeah ok.

 

[Mike Thomas (sunmart)]

The NFL regular season is a exhibition, Giants lose 8 and win Super Bowl. Players laugh with each other at the end of the game at midfield. The RYDER CUP is no exhibition, it brings world class golfers to their knees.

 

[rogerdodger]

Major winner or not....first rule of Captaining no one who says "i shank it every so often in events" is allowed on my team lol.

That should be the first rule, second one is that you should always stand to Webb's left when he has an iron in his hand.

 

[faux_maestro]

MGranato - I completely see what you're saying - but still see at least 2 sides to the coin....

There can't be a more pressured situation than last game out, coming down the last, with the game hanging in the balance. If you were American, then you'd hope that game was irrelevant. But if that game's going to mean something, then you already know that it's gone tits up for the rest of the team and momentum is NOT your friend. That's not an unreasonable place to want to have Tiger.

For what it's worth, I do see that scenario kind of appealing to a rock star ego - not just as an abdication of responsibility.

You also have to ask - if Davis had put Tiger higher up the order, that's a big scalp to hand the Euros if he bombs (again). The Euros probably take more out of beating Tiger than USA gets out of any matches that he wins.

Lastly, to be fair (but not generous) I don't think Tiger's ever even pretended to a leadership role in terms of team dynamic. The best he's been able to say is that he might contribute points - but that's not really happened either.

Q: Will Tiger ever captain a Ryder Cup team?

He will, and the American side will loose 28-0

 

[OLIVER1]

Absolutely brilliant spectacle, wasn't it?
I often wonder about all the hand-wringing and visits to the drawing board the U.S lads go through after getting beaten in this event.
All this chitter-chatter about front-loading, the pod system, captain's picks, the Europeans being more team-inclined, etc. sounds like fodder to keep the D-listers at the Golf Channel in work. If the ball lands on red six times in a row at the roulette table, you chalk it up to statistical fate and move on.
Saying that, though, the Europeans played well so hats off.

 

[drewyallop]

Absolutely brilliant spectacle, wasn't it?
I often wonder about all the hand-wringing and visits to the drawing board the U.S lads go through after getting beaten in this event.
All this chitter-chatter about front-loading, the pod system, captain's picks, the Europeans being more team-inclined, etc. sounds like fodder to keep the D-listers at the Golf Channel in work. If the ball lands on red six times in a row at the roulette table, you chalk it up to statistical fate and move on.
Saying that, though, the Europeans played well so hats off.[/QUOTE

Agree Oli. Comebacks are exciting regardless. And over 3 days the odds evened out and it ended up a very close thing. Pairing/placing arguments is good fodder for hindsight analysis but I believe captains could have just pulled them out of the hat and had the same chance of being right or wrong. World rankings and recent form usually have little correlation with how someone will do on the day.

 

[dschultz6072]

Stricks and Furyk damaged goods! What a time to have a bad week.

 

[OLIVER1]

I believe captains could have just pulled them out of the hat and had the same chance of being right or wrong. World rankings and recent form usually have little correlation with how someone will do on the day.[/QUOTE]


Yes, yes, Drew. Absolutely. Suppose you have four guys in foursomes, two will play well, the other two have a bad day . If you pair the two bad players together you'll probably win one and lose one. Put a bad player with a good player and you'll lose both games, and who on earth can see what's going to come out that day?
The Ryder Cup is like a blackjack game in Atlantic City where the captains are trying to count the cards to give their team the 3% edge over the house. Problem is they're not sat at the table long enough to allow the edge to kick in: So the best laid plans of mice and men...

 

[johnnymarlboro]

I don't think it's fair to discount the captain's picks because they're older guys either. If he picked Fowler or someone and they lost people would be bitching about him not going with experience. Look at Raymond Floyd in '93. He was 51 and played great. It can really go either way, especially in match play.

I HATE how when a guy misses a long putt to halve or win a hole the announcers are all "I can't believe he missed that putt, what a mistake! The pressure's really getting to him." Really, you can't believe he didn't make a winding 20 foot downhill, sidehill putt in tournament conditions? If you could make every putt you wanted to this game would be alot easier. I also think any announcer known to have the yips (this means you Johnny Miller) referring to any putt over 6 inches in tournament golf as "easy" is laughable. It was a team effort, and it took everyone working together to lose this one.

"Losers always whine about their best. Winners go home and f**k the prom queen!"

 

[mgranato]

Absolutely brilliant spectacle, wasn't it?
I often wonder about all the hand-wringing and visits to the drawing board the U.S lads go through after getting beaten in this event.
All this chitter-chatter about front-loading, the pod system, captain's picks, the Europeans being more team-inclined, etc. sounds like fodder to keep the D-listers at the Golf Channel in work. If the ball lands on red six times in a row at the roulette table, you chalk it up to statistical fate and move on.
Saying that, though, the Europeans played well so hats off.

I lost a lot of interest in this cup after Saturday. I was more disappointed with the probability of a lopsided meaningless singles session than I was excited about the home team having the lead. This isn't one of those flag waiving events for me, just really hoping to see a good old brawl (as much as golf can be one). And much to everyone's surprise (or dismay), that's what we got. The Euros needed to play great and get some help... including from the state police. It was a fun compelling day of viewing which IMO equals a good Ryder Cup.

As Mike Tyson says, “I take my hand off” to the European Team. Jolly well played.

 

[fronesis]

Lots of stuff to respond to, but just a couple of quick comments:

1. Steve Stricker should get up and down 99 times out of 100 from the spot he was in on 17. There was nothing at all hard about that shot. If he does get up and down, then he earns at least half a point, and then Tiger has a chance to win the cup. Tiger didn't play great on Sunday, but he was completely dialed in coming down the stretch and clearly hit the best iron shot of the day at 17 and put himself in position A on 18. Everyone questioning the decision to put Tiger out last might be looking at things differently if Stricker just gets up and down on 17.

2. Whatever else you say about this cup, you have to give the Euro team enormous credit for their play late on Saturday and all day on Sunday. Rose and Poulter played some of the best golf under pressure that I have ever seen played. It was truly incredible.

3. I'm not a huge Phil fan, but I have a different reaction to his Sunday actions than others. Phil played well, and I give him complete credit for the sportsmanship showed in applauding Justin's putt on 17. It was a classy response. I also thought it was a nice move on Tiger's part to not make Molinari sink his last putt. But the real sporting move would have been if Molinari conceded the hole and went to celebrate with his team-mates. I agree: no way Tiger takes 3 to get down from there if there's still something to play for. (And since I'm on this topic: what was Kuchar thinking making Westwood hole his 10 inch putt to win?)

 

[DCgolf]

Gotta hand it to Euros. At Brookline we came back on home turf. They came back in a Foreign land. One helluva Euro performance. The Seve factor still looms large from the beyond. Tough to deal with spirits. Also interesting was the German redemption. A miss at Kiawah and a make at Medinah. Wow.

 

[mgranato]

(And since I'm on this topic: what was Kuchar thinking making Westwood hole his 10 inch putt to win?)

Complete bush league move. He can put this award next to his Players crystal...

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

I don't think it's fair to discount the captain's picks because they're older guys either. If he picked Fowler or someone and they lost people would be bitching about him not going with experience. Look at Raymond Floyd in '93. He was 51 and played great. It can really go either way, especially in match play.

I HATE how when a guy misses a long putt to halve or win a hole the announcers are all "I can't believe he missed that putt, what a mistake! The pressure's really getting to him." Really, you can't believe he didn't make a winding 20 foot downhill, sidehill putt in tournament conditions? If you could make every putt you wanted to this game would be alot easier. I also think any announcer known to have the yips (this means you Johnny Miller) referring to any putt over 6 inches in tournament golf as "easy" is laughable. It was a team effort, and it took everyone working together to lose this one.

"Losers always whine about their best. Winners go home and f**k the prom queen!"

I'm not the biggest JM lover as a sportscaster and you shouldn't consider his putting issues when he describes a putt. I thought he was fair describing certain putts. On some putts where they were obviously difficult, he pointed it out and something like "this breaks more than you think and even fooled me when i looked at this morning. We'll see if he figures it out." I forgot what hole that was but i think it was the driveable par 4. However on the putts that were fairly straight or only a minor break, technically, those are easy putts excluding the pressure which he noted as well. He was trying to get the audience to know the difference between a hard putt missed and a putt missed that was probably caused by pressure or a bad stroke since, pressure/mechanical errors removed, the putt isn't difficult.

 

[faux_maestro]

Lots of stuff to respond to, but just a couple of quick comments:

1. Steve Stricker should get up and down 99 times out of 100 from the spot he was in on 17. There was nothing at all hard about that shot. If he does get up and down, then he earns at least half a point, and then Tiger has a chance to win the cup. Tiger didn't play great on Sunday, but he was completely dialed in coming down the stretch and clearly hit the best iron shot of the day at 17 and put himself in position A on 18. Everyone questioning the decision to put Tiger out last might be looking at things differently if Stricker just gets up and down on 17.

2. Whatever else you say about this cup, you have to give the Euro team enormous credit for their play late on Saturday and all day on Sunday. Rose and Poulter played some of the best golf under pressure that I have ever seen played. It was truly incredible.

3. I'm not a huge Phil fan, but I have a different reaction to his Sunday actions than others. Phil played well, and I give him complete credit for the sportsmanship showed in applauding Justin's putt on 17. It was a classy response. I also thought it was a nice move on Tiger's part to not make Molinari sink his last putt. But the real sporting move would have been if Molinari conceded the hole and went to celebrate with his team-mates. I agree: no way Tiger takes 3 to get down from there if there's still something to play for. (And since I'm on this topic: what was Kuchar thinking making Westwood hole his 10 inch putt to win?)

He was thinking "it's Lee Westwood on a 10 inch putt it's at least 50/50 he misses this one I mean have you seen his stroke?"

 

[Kevin Shields]

Yeah ok.

Tell me where I'm wrong

 

[Kevin Shields]

I respectfully disagree. I believe the Ryder Cup does matter as much as majors for one reason: TEAM.

I rarely see as much emotion at a major as I do in a Ryder Cup which signifies "meaning" to me.

It's not an exhibition, it's a fight and at its roots it's "we are better than you".

I love the Ryder Cup. Watched every minute I could and was on the edge of my seat. It just never defines careers unless it's to say how many times an individual has made the team. As in "6 time major winner, 4 time Ryder Cup team member".

 

[gmbtempe]

No one cares about the Ryder Cup when talking about careers, its a side note, unless of course its your defining moment because you have little else in terms of PGA or Major wins, a la Poulter, Montgomery.