The Passive Pivot of the Lower Body

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The Hammer

The Hammer

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Brian Manzella said:
Well....

If you think about it, it is EASIER to snap your "Kinetic Chain" in a chair or off your knees.
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Brian you got the point about this post. With the K-Vest and I know it is not as good as a pro 3-D machine but it still shows the chain, I am now testing swings with the feet pointing square and not flared out to provide more of a braking effect. I am seeing a better chain sequence at impact with most golfers doing this are hitting it longer and straighter with not much increase in club head speed. This means that the contact at impact is better. I am trying to create different ways to snap it better and I now see how it is related to better impact and not just more club head speed. More accuracy at impact is the key.
 
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Brian Manzella

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The Hammer said:
Brian you got the point about this post. With the K-Vest and I know it is not as good as a pro 3-D machine but it still shows the chain, I am now testing swings with the feet pointing square and not flared out to provide more of a braking effect. I am seeing a better chain sequence at impact with most golfers doing this are hitting it longer and straighter with not much increase in club head speed. This means that the contact at impact is better. I am trying to create different ways to snap it better and I now see how it is related to better impact and not just more club head speed. More accuracy at impact is the key.
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I NEVER liked that flared out left foot.

The KEY THING to remember is the ideal sequence is FAST ACCELERATION followed by FAST BREAKING.

Great impact will result.
;)
 
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jaridyard

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puttmad said:
Throw a ball and tell me where the speed comes from....:)

In fact, just do the action of throwing in front of you...
Which bit is moving faster, the arm or the hand?.....
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Might I suggest that the hands (wrists) provide a multiplication of speed already present in the system/sequence. Approx 1.8 times in fact.

But...

Remove the speed from the system before it reaches the hands or remove the potential of multiplication by removing the hands...

You have a very inefficient system! :)
 
H

holeout

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puttmad said:
Throw a ball and tell me where the speed comes from....:)

In fact, just do the action of throwing in front of you...
Which bit is moving faster, the arm or the hand?.....
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To quote Brian:

Umm, no.

How about you go and tell Josh Beckett to save his energy by just using his arm and hand to throw 95+ mph fastballs. While you're at it, tell David Ortiz to "quite down his pivot".

Do that, and you'll get laughed clear out of Fenway Park, or any other Major League Baseball stadium in the country.

Any athlete involved in a sport that requires speed or power will tell you where that speed and power comes from. And it ain't the hands and arms.
 
The Hammer

The Hammer

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golfer24 said:
Throw a ball without using your hips and it won't go anywhere either.
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Try throwing a ball with only the hips (no hands or arms). Then throw the ball with only the right hand and arm (no hips). The right hand and arm will throw it twice as far easy and with more accuracy. Get real!!
 
The Hammer

The Hammer

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Burner said:
Sounds like a bag of assorted spanners being shaken!!!!!!:)

Hope it runs better than it looks and sounds.
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It is obvious you have never heard a big V-twin motor with straight pipes and a belt drive. You probably prefer mopeds or scooters. Quiet and slow. That seems to be the thing for you Tea Bags. On the other hand us Yanks go for the real power and stretched out choppers. It is all American just like apple pie. We call spanners wrenches as well.

:D
 
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mandrin

mandrin

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The Hammer said:
I believe the pivot of the lower body should be for impact accuracy only. The bigger or aggressive the pivot of the lower body is, the harder it is to stay in balance and stay in sync with the circular motion of the hands and arms and the less accurate impact is.

The bigger and more aggressive the pivot of the lower body is the less accurate impact is period!
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The Hammer

It always remains interesting this ongoing debate to decide if the golf swing is done either from the inside-out or from the outside-in - or formulated slightly differently - the swing is it a bottom-up or a top-down action? :confused:

The fascinating thing about golf is that every time that someone comes to a definite conclusion, one always can find another plausible source stating just the opposite. Lee Treevino, not all that bad a ball striker has made the comment that “Golf is a game entirely played below the waist.” ;)
 
H

holeout

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It seems that out of all of this, the conclusions are:

1. The pivot can create some accuracy; the arms and hands can create much more.

2. The arms can create some speed; the pivot can create much more and add to what the arms/hands/club are doing.

To make an example, Brian once talked about a man he knew who had no control over the muscles in one of his arms; it was basically limp. When asked what he would do if his wife's purse was stolen, the man said he could pack plenty of a wallop by just swinging his arm around with his body.

Now, imagine two scenarios. You can either have someone hold your body completely still, and you get to punch someone with just your arm and hand, or you can have someone deaden your arm with some kind of Novocaine, and you get to wallop someone in the head with your dead arm by use of your body pivot.

If you have to punch someone square in their right eye, which do you use? If you have to knock someone out in one hit, which one do you use?
 
mandrin

mandrin

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Brian Manzella said:
The KEY THING to remember is the ideal sequence is FAST ACCELERATION followed by FAST BREAKING.
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Brian,

Is this meant to be more like a quick snappy slogan or is it something you really teach as a desirable action?

In golf down swing, a very short fleeting moment, it is extremely difficult to execute sequentially two opposing actions during the down swing.

Tiger as a junior player sequentially deliberately squatted and got up on his toes, but abandoned this approach eventually.

In a golf down swing acceleration is cause whereas deceleration primarily effect, not a conscious braking action executed by the golfer.

One can mentally direct oneself to swing forcefully only ‘up to a point”. This will bring the deceleration into play somewhat earlier but still more as an effect.
 
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Bigwill

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I think it's a matter of perspective, meaning whatever that person has to focus on so that his or her swing is properly sequenced. I've often seen players who say that their focus is solely on swinging just the hands and arms, and their pivots are flying. That's the problem with golf instruction; a lot of it is based on feel. The problem with that is that two different feels can be absolutely correct, depending upon who is utilizing them. Sure, you can hit the ball far swinging in a chair, but you can bet you'll hit it farther standing in a proper golf address position. You need to use both a proper pivot, and an effective arm/hand/club swing, in order to maximize your results.
 
B

Brian Manzella

Administrator
Yes.

I remember the day I showed this "fast deceleration" to Mike Jacobs.

It took a few tries, but when he did it, he couldn't believe it.

Lindsey Gahm has been taught to accel-decel from the time she was quite young, and she drives it very far and very straight.

I believe it can be DONE and it can be TAUGHT.
 
mandrin

mandrin

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Brian Manzella said:
Lindsey Gahm has been taught to accel-decel from the time she was quite young, and she drives it very far and very straight.

I believe it can be DONE and it can be TAUGHT.
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Brian,

In golf as in any other activity it is important to use terms meaning the same for all. It would therefore very beneficial to have your explanation/definition of what constitutes active braking by a golfer in the down swing.
 
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