BOMBSHELL: New Research from the Manzella Labs!
- Thread starter Brian Manzella
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Brian did say "nearly" straight. I'd think that is pretty compatible with your few tenths of a degree.
I don't think he was advocating a perfect straight line through the ball - he's not Dave Pelz
Just like there is obviously no way it could be perfectly flat through impact - how would you take a divot?!
Why would you want to? I thought the divot was a necessary evil. Necessary because you couldn't create a straight line/flat spot. If you can, then there's no need for a divot.
FLAT SPOT VERSUS ARC
Flat spot = more downward pre impact less upward post impact COMBINED WITH more outward pre impact and less inward post impact. Right?
It is a mystery to me why it's so important when no-one even putts in a straight line and I also doubt there is any real advantage in concocting this weird combination of movements.
Flat spot = more downward pre impact less upward post impact COMBINED WITH more outward pre impact and less inward post impact. Right?
It is a mystery to me why it's so important when no-one even putts in a straight line and I also doubt there is any real advantage in concocting this weird combination of movements.
Todd Dugan
New
After thinking a bit more about it, I'll refine what I said earlier to this....
If a center of rotation moves, the orbit of the rotating body is altered. There are several centers of rotation in the golf stroke, and they move as the clubhead swings through the impact zone. Therefore, a perfect radius of the orbiting sweetspot is unlikely. But, since there is rotation around centers, it is also unlikely that the sweetspot trajectory is truly linear for any duration.
Either way, with sufficient force, the trajectory of the sweetspot, through the impact zone, lies in-plane.
But hey, I'm no scientist.
If a center of rotation moves, the orbit of the rotating body is altered. There are several centers of rotation in the golf stroke, and they move as the clubhead swings through the impact zone. Therefore, a perfect radius of the orbiting sweetspot is unlikely. But, since there is rotation around centers, it is also unlikely that the sweetspot trajectory is truly linear for any duration.
Either way, with sufficient force, the trajectory of the sweetspot, through the impact zone, lies in-plane.
But hey, I'm no scientist.
oldpro
New
Left hand "V" centered (slightly weak)
Right hand conventional
Use first two take away moves (minus the hip shift left) in the "building Blocks" video, no roll
Bend right side of belly into/towards right hip bone Start of DS (this lowers upper body, sets small hip set and proper weight onto left foot, this lowers the arms)
Face with be very slightly open coming in (optimal)
Fire at the exact dead center of the ball, rotate, this creates a rather long flow of the right arm (Hoganish look)
Right hand bent "very" slightly back (no exaggerated flying wedge necessary)
He almost had it in his "never hook again" video, but the shoulder move in the DS + hand carry went a bit too far for straight, however modify that to taste and yes, he is golden!!
Straight as a string
I hit a couple hundered balls today --- zero pulls--a few slight pushes---best practice session in several years---never would have figured it out without seeing that building blocks video.
I always have had back extension in my finish so I barely take a divot, a very clean ball hitter so it's my impression that combo results in straight rather than pulls or pull hooks.
Long clubs I do aim right, not much, but I always have. With irons I'm always a tiny bit open. Don't ask me why, my only guess is I aim right with the woods as I feel more powerful in that setup and I swing very hard with the driver where the irons I'm thinking line and how far it goes to landing.
Right hand conventional
Use first two take away moves (minus the hip shift left) in the "building Blocks" video, no roll
Bend right side of belly into/towards right hip bone Start of DS (this lowers upper body, sets small hip set and proper weight onto left foot, this lowers the arms)
Face with be very slightly open coming in (optimal)
Fire at the exact dead center of the ball, rotate, this creates a rather long flow of the right arm (Hoganish look)
Right hand bent "very" slightly back (no exaggerated flying wedge necessary)
He almost had it in his "never hook again" video, but the shoulder move in the DS + hand carry went a bit too far for straight, however modify that to taste and yes, he is golden!!
Straight as a string
I hit a couple hundered balls today --- zero pulls--a few slight pushes---best practice session in several years---never would have figured it out without seeing that building blocks video.
I always have had back extension in my finish so I barely take a divot, a very clean ball hitter so it's my impression that combo results in straight rather than pulls or pull hooks.
Long clubs I do aim right, not much, but I always have. With irons I'm always a tiny bit open. Don't ask me why, my only guess is I aim right with the woods as I feel more powerful in that setup and I swing very hard with the driver where the irons I'm thinking line and how far it goes to landing.
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islandgolf629
New
This is nothing new or ground breaking; Jimmy Demaret talked about flat spots back in the 1950s.
NEXT!!!
NEXT!!!
oldpro
New
westy
New
nope
nothing at all. its all been done before.
move along.
next.
hogan is better than dustin johnson.
trackman is a waste of time
scores havent got better
bobby jones knew it all.
wake up.
the fact that demaret mentioned it dosent mean we all got it.
except you maybe.
westy
New
just throwing this out there
into the world
.......WHAT IF 'THE PLANE' DOSENT EXIST.......
what if the club is moving on a curve.
in 3D
and swing plane has little to no relevance
only the tiny little bit we are talking about in this thread is the bit that counts
and that its straight.
or straightish
and the general plane of orbit of the club, shaft, sweetspot or whatever is not really all that relevant.
huh.
?
into the world
.......WHAT IF 'THE PLANE' DOSENT EXIST.......
what if the club is moving on a curve.
in 3D
and swing plane has little to no relevance
only the tiny little bit we are talking about in this thread is the bit that counts
and that its straight.
or straightish
and the general plane of orbit of the club, shaft, sweetspot or whatever is not really all that relevant.
huh.
?
Yep, I and many here agree--have for a while. I have no horse(s) in the race. But, the "establishment" is still--well, you know.
oldpro
New
I'll give you credit and say it wasn't a lucky guess knowing that I've got it...pretty good on your part though. Brian is right, you guys are good!!! LOL
oldpro
New
Westy...they are hell bent for leather to get the ball curving less and less and less...very soon it'll take an attempt at big curves to hit small curves...meanwhile like me, Brian is in that lab trying to get the formula on straight...straight is in our future no problem...then we only worry about trajectory...add that to the game improvement clubs (forged) that will appear in droves in 2012 (one club stronger and hits it high and long) and the deal is done.
I've already hit some...a Nike set of irons (forged) out of Japan...they go high and very long...you can bend them easy...they will be in the VR line Feb 2012...Those of us who have "got it" get to hit the new stuff early LOL
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oldpro
New
Just send a weekly check of $1,000 until I say no further funds needed to:
He's Got It
USA
Since I'm the only one it'll get to me...Thanks Westy
BrendanC
New
This is what I think is true.
Brian Manzella
Administrator
I have no idea what some of the posts above are talking about.
These are the facts:
1. Folks talked about "flat spots" forever. My 1988 Teaching Summit reference shows I know this to be the case.
2. Good players talked about hitting the back of the ball with a square face to hit it straight for 99 years. TGM folks told them they had it wrong. I was one of them. Not anymore. The D-Plane proves this part of the puzzle to be correct.
3. TGM talks about "hinge action" — the clubface acting like a swinging door, and attic door, or a pitched roof hatch. The answer is "None of the Above."
4. Every decent player who doesn't do something really crazy down by the ball does the "dent in the hula hoop."
5. Through the ball—a few inches before and a couple after—EVERYONE WHO CAN HOT A SHOT has very little clubface motion.
What it is, is this:
The clubhead gets on a mini-curve with very little open clubface, and then the club gets nearly on a straight line with a square face, and it pretty much looks like a putt from there.
The following swing is a 9-hanidcapper. I have plenty of these, and I will post a few of them up in the next 24 hours. I have Kevin Shields, David Toms, Lindsay Gahm, and others.
Here is the 9 handicapper:
The swing was a "zero path" (+/= 0.8° from 0.0) and "zero face" (+/= 0.8° from 0.0) and a very slightly heel strike.
<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/16245294?portrait=0" width="640" height="160" frameborder="0"></iframe>
These are the facts:
1. Folks talked about "flat spots" forever. My 1988 Teaching Summit reference shows I know this to be the case.
2. Good players talked about hitting the back of the ball with a square face to hit it straight for 99 years. TGM folks told them they had it wrong. I was one of them. Not anymore. The D-Plane proves this part of the puzzle to be correct.
3. TGM talks about "hinge action" — the clubface acting like a swinging door, and attic door, or a pitched roof hatch. The answer is "None of the Above."
4. Every decent player who doesn't do something really crazy down by the ball does the "dent in the hula hoop."
5. Through the ball—a few inches before and a couple after—EVERYONE WHO CAN HOT A SHOT has very little clubface motion.
What it is, is this:
The clubhead gets on a mini-curve with very little open clubface, and then the club gets nearly on a straight line with a square face, and it pretty much looks like a putt from there.
The following swing is a 9-hanidcapper. I have plenty of these, and I will post a few of them up in the next 24 hours. I have Kevin Shields, David Toms, Lindsay Gahm, and others.
Here is the 9 handicapper:
The swing was a "zero path" (+/= 0.8° from 0.0) and "zero face" (+/= 0.8° from 0.0) and a very slightly heel strike.
<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/16245294?portrait=0" width="640" height="160" frameborder="0"></iframe>
2. Good players talked about hitting the back of the ball with a square face to hit it straight for 99 years. TGM folks told them they had it wrong. I was one of them. Not anymore. The D-Plane proves this part of the puzzle to be correct.
Could someone explain this statement for me?
Could someone explain this statement for me?
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