Sergio Garcia Analysis by Brian Manzella...Golf Magazine Style!
- Thread starter Brian Manzella
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Steve Khatib
Super Moderator
I still think too technical. Stack and tilt is also too technical however Baddeley validates it so its worth reading
!Sergio
He may do that as well, but most of Sergio's bad shots that I have witnessed have been not turning through the shot well enough. As Brian noted, Serg needs to turn through aggressively. I think it occurs mostly for Sergio when not committed or in between clubs. Not that he hits many poor shots. I think he is one of the best.
Nice analysis, Brian. Technical enough to teach something. Not so technical as to spin the head.
He may do that as well, but most of Sergio's bad shots that I have witnessed have been not turning through the shot well enough. As Brian noted, Serg needs to turn through aggressively. I think it occurs mostly for Sergio when not committed or in between clubs. Not that he hits many poor shots. I think he is one of the best.
Nice analysis, Brian. Technical enough to teach something. Not so technical as to spin the head.
tongzilla
New
Sergio swings more left through the ball by making sure his arms go in the same direction to where his body is turning after impact. If he breaks/snaps his kinetic chain too early, it might cause his arms and hands to go to right field, so his arms and body are no longer working together.
Steve Khatib
Super Moderator
Float loading is the greatest deterant to over acceleration.
Ryan Smither
Super Moderator
I can hear the cheerleaders chanting...
once-a-month...once-a-month...once-a-month...
once-a-month...once-a-month...once-a-month...
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
Well said. Late hitting elbow planers often swing too far right.
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
Four barrels, what's your best float loading drill? I love brian and ben's back and forth divot drill. Any others?
birdie_man
New
Is this a flat or rotated ST...?
thefuture37
Banned
Brian,
In your fiddle drill, you say that the straightening of the right arm and the tilting of the right shoulder down the plane is what allows the "look" of extreme amounts of accumulator lag, as is seen in the picture from your article where you talk about float loading. But if you look at that picture and frame 5 from the swing analysis, he has not tilted his shoulders yet, but he still gets to this position. So when should you tilt the right shoulder in the downswing, at the beginning or after straightening the right arm?
In your fiddle drill, you say that the straightening of the right arm and the tilting of the right shoulder down the plane is what allows the "look" of extreme amounts of accumulator lag, as is seen in the picture from your article where you talk about float loading. But if you look at that picture and frame 5 from the swing analysis, he has not tilted his shoulders yet, but he still gets to this position. So when should you tilt the right shoulder in the downswing, at the beginning or after straightening the right arm?
Brian Manzella
Administrator
High or Low?
There is little doubt that in many golfers who have a "late release"/"accumulator lag"/"trigger delay", they have a LOW left shoulder late in the swing.
For many of the same reasons that a "reverse pivot" will produce less "late release"/"accumulator lag"/"trigger delay," a left shoulder moving up to soon can do the same.
In some the best swings, axis tilt does not occur until late in the downswing!
There is little doubt that in many golfers who have a "late release"/"accumulator lag"/"trigger delay", they have a LOW left shoulder late in the swing.
For many of the same reasons that a "reverse pivot" will produce less "late release"/"accumulator lag"/"trigger delay," a left shoulder moving up to soon can do the same.
In some the best swings, axis tilt does not occur until late in the downswing!
thefuture37
Banned
Thanks for the quick response. The followup question is that is it possible to start your axis tilt too early in the downswing? Does starting the downswing immediately with axis tilt prevent you from fully rotating the shoulders through the shot because of too much tilt?
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
A quote from one of my sessions with Brian that will stick with me forever. Because I have alot of lag and no trouble hitting the inside of the ball, he told me, "no axis tilt until after sit down (on the left leg)". That and some other things changed my entire game.
too early axis-tilt makes you swing more to the right. better players who have no problem hitting the inside of the ball swing too far to the right, and a lower left shoulder and later axis tilt helps them swing 'straighter'
James Marshall (Hogan1953)
New member
There is little doubt that in many golfers who have a "late release"/"accumulator lag"/"trigger delay", they have a LOW left shoulder late in the swing.
For many of the same reasons that a "reverse pivot" will produce less "late release"/"accumulator lag"/"trigger delay," a left shoulder moving up to soon can do the same.
In some the best swings, axis tilt does not occur until late in the downswing!
Brian,
I've seen this a lot as well. Do you think there is any particular reason why the left shoulder going up would tend to cause an early release and clubhead throwaway? Do you think it could be the clubhead moving down and away from the centre of rotation that could have any influence on the left shoulder moving up? Or is it simply the left shoulder moving up which causes the throwaway?
Thanks,
James
tennisdu
New
In the Article BM mentions that Serigo addresses the ball with a more erect posture and higher hands, than most modern days pros. He also stated this was similar to Ben Hogan, another "Double Shifter".
My question is how does this more erect posture and higher hands aid a player who is a "Double Shifter"?
What effects does this set up position have and what players should try to emulate this? Like Garcia I get the shaft and the right forearm on the same plane on the downswing and wonder if a set up similar to this would benefit me?
MD
My question is how does this more erect posture and higher hands aid a player who is a "Double Shifter"?
What effects does this set up position have and what players should try to emulate this? Like Garcia I get the shaft and the right forearm on the same plane on the downswing and wonder if a set up similar to this would benefit me?
MD
1-b
Banned
stick to your guns , you were right .
SERGIO does tilt the axis and move his right shoulder down at start down and his left shoulder up, even though ( frame 5 ) his arms and hands have traveled farther. remember the start down is the period of shoulder acceleration and the downstroke is the period of hand acceleration.
since the right shoulder is closer to the center of the clubhead orbit and the hands are closer to the perimeter, the hands must travel a greater distance in the same amount of time so the accumulators must be released to achieve proper impact alignments . due to this accumulator #4 starts to release and the the right shoulder must stay back and on plane for an on plane centered motion.(the centered motion as well keeps the right shoulder from moving very much DOWN AND FOWARD through his entire stroke.)
god, i sound so golfing machine !!!! i can’t help it, i just love abstraction and preferably sheer abstraction !
it's a shame his coach wants him to "flatten out his plane or the shaft" (frame 4) or whatever ”the great players do.”
and get off plane(frame 4 & 5) in his downstroke, along with float loading ?!!!
it’s a shame his coach ( perhaps i’m being unfair to his coach? ) doesn’t want him to take his right shoulder shoulder, hands ,clubshaft and clubhead ALL DOWNPLANE. as it is his hands and clubshaft are UNDER PLANE and he now has to “swing left” with his hands and arms ( rather than swinging left with his hips and shoulders first ( concentric circles mr. o’grady ?) ) and what appears to be angled hinging ( instead of horizontal hinging ) and then ABOVE PLANE ( instead of ON PLANE ) near finish (frame 7) .
his hands and arms are working real hard to try and maintain alignments !
it's too bad this kid does not have a good instructor. he is so loaded ( no pun intended ) with talent, if you could get him on a better plane he could win a lot of majors .
treating a complex action as complex can ultimately make it simple !!
There is little doubt that in many golfers who have a "late release"/"accumulator lag"/"trigger delay", they have a LOW left shoulder late in the swing.
For many of the same reasons that a "reverse pivot" will produce less "late release"/"accumulator lag"/"trigger delay," a left shoulder moving up to soon can do the same.
In some the best swings, axis tilt does not occur until late in the downswing!
SERGIO does tilt the axis and move his right shoulder down at start down and his left shoulder up, even though ( frame 5 ) his arms and hands have traveled farther. remember the start down is the period of shoulder acceleration and the downstroke is the period of hand acceleration.
since the right shoulder is closer to the center of the clubhead orbit and the hands are closer to the perimeter, the hands must travel a greater distance in the same amount of time so the accumulators must be released to achieve proper impact alignments . due to this accumulator #4 starts to release and the the right shoulder must stay back and on plane for an on plane centered motion.(the centered motion as well keeps the right shoulder from moving very much DOWN AND FOWARD through his entire stroke.)
god, i sound so golfing machine !!!! i can’t help it, i just love abstraction and preferably sheer abstraction !
it's a shame his coach wants him to "flatten out his plane or the shaft" (frame 4) or whatever ”the great players do.”
and get off plane(frame 4 & 5) in his downstroke, along with float loading ?!!!
it’s a shame his coach ( perhaps i’m being unfair to his coach? ) doesn’t want him to take his right shoulder shoulder, hands ,clubshaft and clubhead ALL DOWNPLANE. as it is his hands and clubshaft are UNDER PLANE and he now has to “swing left” with his hands and arms ( rather than swinging left with his hips and shoulders first ( concentric circles mr. o’grady ?) ) and what appears to be angled hinging ( instead of horizontal hinging ) and then ABOVE PLANE ( instead of ON PLANE ) near finish (frame 7) .
his hands and arms are working real hard to try and maintain alignments !
it's too bad this kid does not have a good instructor. he is so loaded ( no pun intended ) with talent, if you could get him on a better plane he could win a lot of majors .
treating a complex action as complex can ultimately make it simple !!
Jared Willerson
Super Moderator
I don't know...he is one of the best ball strikers on tour and in a playoff....for a major... he admittedly did not miss a shot and hit the flag on an approach. You can't be any more under the gun than that and his swing held up well.
What you are advocating (it sounds to me anyway) is getting rid of some of the accumulator lag and have him swing down the TSP and swing more to the right with his hands and arms while the pivot works left.
I just don't think that would work very well for Sergio. I would change very little with him. If anything I would give him a little better pivot ( more of a PBTS type) instead of the tripod. He hits it so good though I think he should leave it alone and work on making 10 footers under the gun.
What you are advocating (it sounds to me anyway) is getting rid of some of the accumulator lag and have him swing down the TSP and swing more to the right with his hands and arms while the pivot works left.
I just don't think that would work very well for Sergio. I would change very little with him. If anything I would give him a little better pivot ( more of a PBTS type) instead of the tripod. He hits it so good though I think he should leave it alone and work on making 10 footers under the gun.
1-b
Banned
i think he has the talent to make the changes , but .....?
glcoach,
being on plane all the way down in the downstroke might not work for sergio. it would be interesting to find out.
and i most certainly agree that practicing ten footers under the gun would help him.
but it would also be interesting to find out if his putting tendencies are similar to his full swing tendencies.
glcoach,
being on plane all the way down in the downstroke might not work for sergio. it would be interesting to find out.
and i most certainly agree that practicing ten footers under the gun would help him.
but it would also be interesting to find out if his putting tendencies are similar to his full swing tendencies.
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