Sergio Garcia Analysis by Brian Manzella...Golf Magazine Style!

[Jared Willerson]

Just to be clear I am not advocating much of any change for Sergio. He is a classic double shifter and there is nothing wrong with that.

He may get under plane a little in the transition, but I think that has more to do with his bent left wrist to maximize accumulator lag. He gets back on the elbow plane when his wrist begins to flatten.

I agree about his putting tendencies. He used to be a great putter, now he just looks uncomfortable over any putt..... I would hate to see what has happened to his putting stroke happen to one of the most dynamic golf swings out there.

 

[1-b]

Just to be clear I am not advocating much of any change for Sergio. He is a classic double shifter and there is nothing wrong with that.

He may get under plane a little in the transition, but I think that has more to do with his bent left wrist to maximize accumulator lag. He gets back on the elbow plane when his wrist begins to flatten.

I agree about his putting tendencies. He used to be a great putter, now he just looks uncomfortable over any putt..... I would hate to see what has happened to his putting stroke happen to one of the most dynamic golf swings out there.

glcoach,

do you think it would be a big change for sergio to start down on plane with the accumulator lag he has , while shifting to the elbow plane ?

i would suggest at least this. and he could still have one of the most dynamic swings in golf.

 

[jake2]

Kinetic chain from hips to shoulders

There is little doubt that in many golfers who have a "late release"/"accumulator lag"/"trigger delay", they have a LOW left shoulder late in the swing.

For many of the same reasons that a "reverse pivot" will produce less "late release"/"accumulator lag"/"trigger delay," a left shoulder moving up to soon can do the same.

In some the best swings, axis tilt does not occur until late in the downswing!

I saw some measurement data on how in good swings rotational speed of hips peaks before shoulder, shoulders before hands and hands before clubhead. Kind of easy to understand how the kinetic chain works as the accumulators release from shoulders > arms/hands > club.
But where's the link between hips and shoulders?

I remembered this post and started thinking that maybe axis tilt has something to with it. This is because it would make shoulders rotate farther away from hips center of rotation. My thought is that if this is true, then axis tilt increase would occur right after hips rotational speed has peaked.

Does this make any sense or what is really happening?

 

[Jared Willerson]

glcoach,

do you think it would be a big change for sergio to start down on plane with the accumulator lag he has , while shifting to the elbow plane ?

i would suggest at least this. and he could still have one of the most dynamic swings in golf.

I agree with that. It wouldn't be that big of a change and I believe that is what he set out to do when he "changed" his swing a little bit in 2001 or 2002.

 

[Kevin Shields]

glcoach,

do you think it would be a big change for sergio to start down on plane with the accumulator lag he has , while shifting to the elbow plane ?

i would suggest at least this. and he could still have one of the most dynamic swings in golf.

Could you please go into a little more detail as to why this would be a good thing for Sergio? I'm very interested. Thanks.

 

[Brian Manzella]

Hmmm...

SERGIO does tilt the axis and move his right shoulder down at start down and his left shoulder up, even though ( frame 5 ) his arms and hands have traveled farther.

Sergio does indeed tilt some by this point (pic at bottom left). He does move his arms a bunch more than average at this point as well.

He just doesn't tilt very much at this point, and his left shoulder is very low at this point, comparatively.

...i sound so golfing machine !!!! i can’t help it, i just love abstraction and preferably sheer abstraction !

That's why I have the biggest one of these sites...I prefer stuff that makes sense to more golfers—and teachers.

That's also why I can TEACH as well as I do.

it's a shame his coach wants him to "flatten out his plane or the shaft" (frame 4) or whatever ”the great players do.”

Nah,

What's a shame is that you did learn why some golfers double-shift and some don't. I thought I was very clear.

And BTW, his "coach" is his Dad, and I'd bet HIGH he never told Sergio to shift. Like I said...

and get off plane(frame 4 & 5) in his downstroke, along with float loading?

Another unfortunate soul that doesn't like float loading.

Off plane....pul-ease.

it’s a shame his coach ( perhaps i’m being unfair to his coach? ) doesn’t want him to take his right shoulder shoulder, hands ,clubshaft and clubhead ALL DOWNPLANE.

Too much Kool-Aid will make you have a sugar high and then crash.

as it is his hands and clubshaft are UNDER PLANE and he now has to “swing left” with his hands and arms— rather than swinging left with his hips and shoulders first—and what appears to be angled hinging (instead of horizontal hinging) and then ABOVE PLANE (instead of ON PLANE ) near finish (frame 7) .

According to you.

I completely disagree, but....you knew that already, that's why you are here.

his hands and arms are working real hard to try and maintain alignments !

Nope.

Too much force to resist.

Well Ray Lewis tackles you, you can resist, but it won't matter much.

it's too bad this kid does not have a good instructor. he is so loaded ( no pun intended ) with talent, if you could get him on a better plane he could win a lot of majors .

You'd teach him right off the Tour.

treating a complex action as complex can ultimately make it simple !!

No, It makes the students run for something easier.

 

[birdie_man]

Ray Lewis:

(I think he may be snapping this man's neck)

 

[Kevin Shields]

Ray Lewis:

(I think he may be snapping this man's neck)

Is that a four barrell, maximum participation ass kicking??

 

[1-b]

perhaps , perhaps not ?

Sergio does indeed tilt some by this point (pic at bottom left). He does move his arms a bunch more than average at this point as well.

He just doesn't tilt very much at this point, and his left shoulder is very low at this point, comparatively.



That's why I have the biggest one of these sites...I prefer stuff that makes sense to more golfers—and teachers.

That's also why I can TEACH as well as I do.



Nah,

What's a shame is that you did learn why some golfers double-shift and some don't. I thought I was very clear.

And BTW, his "coach" is his Dad, and I'd bet HIGH he never told Sergio to shift. Like I said...



Another unfortunate soul that doesn't like float loading.

Off plane....pul-ease.



Too much Kool-Aid will make you have a sugar high and then crash.



According to you.

I completely disagree, but....you knew that already, that's why you are here.



Nope.

Too much force to resist.

Well Ray Lewis tackles you, you can resist, but it won't matter much.



You'd teach him right off the Tour.



No, It makes the students run for something easier.

brian,
nice job.

could you do anything to improve sergio ?

 

[Brian Manzella]

Well...

brian,
nice job.

could you do anything to improve sergio ?

After I told him to stay away from you, I'd explain ball-flight to him, and tell him WHY his swing worked, and then we'd go fix his putting.

 

[1-b]

plane , controversial ?

Could you please go into a little more detail as to why this would be a good thing for Sergio? I'm very interested. Thanks.

the cluhead would have a more direct line to the ball.

 

[Brian Manzella]

Think about this:

I saw a very good player who is a big fan of the no-shift patterns teaching sect.

He made a tour-caliber swing in a booth at the PGA Show.

I said: "Hey 'John,' A perfect double-shift."

He said: "I don't think about shifts anymore."​

I am pretty sure he tried that no shifting stuff for a while.

Now, he just does what produces the best results.

Got it, 1-b?

 

[1-b]

????

I saw a very good player who is a big fan of the no-shift patterns teaching sect.

He made a tour-caliber swing in a booth at the PGA Show.

I said: "Hey 'John,' A perfect double-shift."

He said: "I don't think about shifts anymore."​

I am pretty sure he tried that no shifting stuff for a while.

Now, he just does what produces the best results.

Got it, 1-b?

good point brian,

i would agree that you want to do what gives you the best results !

who would disagree with that ?

but are you saying it's not possible to single shift ?

or that you don't want to consider what the shaft is doing.

 

[1-b]

those little guys can be unruly at times !

Could you please go into a little more detail as to why this would be a good thing for Sergio? I'm very interested. Thanks.

doubled,

let's do a thought experiment. imagine that we have ten little ray lewis' moving the clubshaft.

they all move it right up the inclined plane.

but let's suppose that as they are starting down one of the ray lewis' gets crazy and moves the shaft off the plane. now another of the ray lewis' or maybe two realize that they need to help move it back onto the plane.

now we have two or three ray lewis' working against one another in opposite directions. while the other seven or eight are pulling and/ or pushing it in another direction.

wouldn't it be easier and better for all ten little ray lewis' to be working together pushing and/or pulling the shaft downplane ?

wouldn't the ball get more of an asskicking ?!!


the golfing machine is not that hard to understand if you can understand the concept ray lewis.

 

[Kevin Shields]

Appreciate the response, but i'm not sure i'm following. Are you saying that when Segio goes for the strike (after the shift) he doesnt have all his ray lewis'(i prefer Jack Lamberts') working together?

 

[DOCW3]

Do some/most tour players just think about turning their shoulders on a plane that is above the ball and swinging their arms up on one plane and then down on a flatter plane? What is the significance of the Hogan Plane? Are tour players concrned about plane shifts as defined by TGM?

 

[Brian Manzella]

???

but are you saying it's not possible to single shift ?

I didn't even allude to that.

I alluded to the fact that book literalists love the idea of the NO-shift pattern.

And, since you are a book literalist, who probably thinks Aaron Zick is woefully off-track, I made a point.

A very good one too, I may add.

This golfer had TRIED—apparently unsuccessfully—to do the silly "shaft on the turned shoulder plane" address SHAFT pointing up the Turned Shoulder Plane...and had tried the silly NO-Shift plane angle variation.

He junked them both, and now sets-up on nearly the HANDS ONLY plane at address, and made what looked to me to be a PERFECT DOUBLE-SHIFT.

He seems very happy with his swing and the results it produced.

I think he is concerned with what the shaft is doing, and like Double-Shifters BEN HOGAN and BYRON NELSON, is controlling this part of the club very, every well.

or that you don't want to consider what the shaft is doing.

I ALLOW the double-shift and the single-shift, as well as a host of OTHER variations.

But I rarely teach them.

Get it?

 

[Brian Manzella]

???!

...wouldn't it be easier and better for all ten little ray lewis' to be working together pushing and/or pulling the shaft downplane ?

wouldn't the ball get more of an asskicking ?!!

Sounds like you buy into the idea that effective mass can be increased if the force vectors are all focused in the same direction, or at the same point. Something like the TOTAL being greater than the SUM.

Ahhh, sorry, it really doesn't matter. Only the speed. And I'd bet you a bunch of money, that Sergio would shift MORE trying to win a long drive contest.

the golfing machine is not that hard to understand if you can understand the concept ray lewis.

The MANZELLA MATRIX is pretty easy to understand if you'd open up that little yellow tin can of a paradigm you are living in.

 

[1-b]

a plane so pure the line does not even exist ?

I didn't even allude to that.

I alluded to the fact that book literalists love the idea of the NO-shift pattern.

And, since you are a book literalist, who probably thinks Aaron Zick is woefully off-track, I made a point.

A very good one too, I may add.

This golfer had TRIED—apparently unsuccessfully—to do the silly "shaft on the turned shoulder plane" address SHAFT pointing up the Turned Shoulder Plane...and had tried the silly NO-Shift plane angle variation.

He junked them both, and now sets-up on nearly the HANDS ONLY plane at address, and made what looked to me to be a PERFECT DOUBLE-SHIFT.

He seems very happy with his swing and the results it produced.

I think he is concerned with what the shaft is doing, and like Double-Shifters BEN HOGAN and BYRON NELSON, is controlling this part of the club very, every well.



I ALLOW the double-shift and the single-shift, as well as a host of OTHER variations.

But I rarely teach them.

Get it?

i agree that there is a huge chasm betwee the platonic world of the idea and the gritty, ugly, reality that we live in. especially when it comes to golf.

if i were truly a book literalist i would realize that there are trillions (?) of acceptable(probably the wrong word) variations. but i didn't realize i said i was a book literalist, i think you did.

who is aaron zick ?

 

[tongzilla]

And I'd bet you a bunch of money, that Sergio would shift MORE trying to win a long drive contest.

Why?

Would someone who's a natural single shifter (or someone who uses the TSP on the downstroke) also exhibit this tendency to shift to a shallower plane when trying to hit it harder?