Alan Hocknell of Callaway.....

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Kevin Shields

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jbrunk said:
Another thread to nowhere I see.

Man this stuff is really getting old.
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I apologize for it. I wish there was something to do about it. The website will apparently be changing very soon where no one will have to deal with his or any other bullshit.
 
lia41985

lia41985

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Not saying they, Steve and Lindsey, are Luddites but I admire how they're not overly enthralled by something dressed up in technology and thinking it's an advance based on science. The Luddites had a similar skeptical perspective.
 
magicmarker

magicmarker

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It is baloney because ANY golfer I have EVER seen swing a club knows how to open or close the face ON THEIR OWN in the SAME WAY that the 'sole plate' would theoretically work.
 
natep

natep

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Kevin Shields said:
I apologize for it. I wish there was something to do about it. The website will apparently be changing very soon where no one will have to deal with his or any other bullshit.
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Manz mentioned this before, what kind of changes are in the works?
 
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art

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lia41985 said:
Speaking of conducting research...what about this from before?

Link: http://www.brianmanzella.com/golfing-discussions/17825-what-kind-release-can-effective-swing-include-no-deceleration-43.html#post239352

I suppose y'all are qualified to run experiments? Even though you have no scientific experience? Oh, you'll rely here and there on Art and whoever else?

I can do the same and still not appeal to authority. That's what happens when you read these papers with a critical eye, Finney.

What about the clamp issue? Why not run the experiment for yourself or see it run for yourself?

The funny this is when you can't answer a question that's directly addressed to you (and this is the same for Brian) all I hear is names of scientists "shout out" in ALL CAPS as a "reply". Lol.
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Dear Lia, Mike and visitors of this thread,

I see my name being used here and 'feel' it necessary to respond, and voice my sadness for what I understand (maybe misunderstand) to be just a detail of the science of the golf swing, but IMO, a growing and unproductive use of this type of communication.

Lia, the situation that led to the thread you referenced above had to do with the angular velocity profile of the pelvis/hips during the downswing, and whether, and much more importantly to me, WHY it decelerated into impact. I am fully prepared to participate in any testing or analytical research to discuss and hopefully settle this issue.

BUT, I do not have the same confidence in understanding the role of the firmness of the grip during the impact/collision time period, however if asked, I certainly have a 'science-based' opinion. But please understand, IMO, this area insignificantly affects the priorities of the down swings major objectives of distance, accuracy, and most important, reduced injury potential.

Please correct me if you see this differently. My major source of input comes from research and data of grip forces from a variety of pressure sensors located on the fingers and palm of both hands, and frequency response data on the club shaft from a variety of sources.

Sincerely,
art.
 
faux_maestro

faux_maestro

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lia41985 said:
Not saying they, Steve and Lindsey, are Luddites but I admire how they're not overly enthralled by something dressed up in technology and thinking it's an advance based on science. The Luddites had a similar skeptical perspective.
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Sorry if I missed your point. I was under the impression that a modern use of "Luddites" was for someone opposed to all new technologies in general, not just new technologies that are not improvements or that don't actually work as intended.
 
lia41985

lia41985

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art,
The point of the clamp experiment isn't to imply that the "grip" has some sort of isolated importance. Rather, it's that the clamp serves as a perhaps subtle example of how getting the body to work as a "precise delivery system" by, amongst other options, utilizing setup features (like putting the bumpy back) and utilizing the spine and the anatomy in general, in concert with the body's proprioceptive capacity, creates the conditions for/potential for golfing success. I hope that clarifies my perspective.

Thanks,
lia

P.S. The clamp analogy becomes more instructive, I believe, when we consider the oft-encountered example of gear-effect influenced strikes/impacts.
 
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lia41985

lia41985

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art said:
BUT, I do not have the same confidence in understanding the role of the firmness of the grip during the impact/collision time period, however if asked, I certainly have a 'science-based' opinion. But please understand, IMO, this area insignificantly affects the priorities of the down swings major objectives of distance, accuracy, and most important, reduced injury potential.

Please correct me if you see this differently.
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Emphasis added by me. Not that I am trying to correct you but I find what you've written to be quite ironic.
 
faux_maestro

faux_maestro

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Also, arguments from authority or appeals to authority are not necessarily bad. They REALLY only become a problem when the "authority" is not really an authority at all (see any celebrity in a commercial for anything) or if there is no consensus among various authorities. It is then a "fallacious appeal to authority", and that is bad. I don't believe that is what we have here.
 
lia41985

lia41985

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The problem is that it's not even a mere appeal to authority. It's saying a name then calling the person the best in the biz/industry/etc. That's an insufficient answer when you're posed a direct question.
 
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art

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coach said:
Art,
I would love to see/hear what the data showed about grip forces and pressure
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Dear coach,
Always good to hear from you.

My interest in grip pressure came a few years ago as I uncovered the magnitude of the various forces in the body from the many rotating parts.

With the 'grip' longitudinal force of over 100 pounds at impact, and virtually right down the shafts axi, I became interested in how, and more importantly, how much 'normal' force and friction was required to prevent the club from being pulled out of the golfers hands.

Of course this led to the need for me to better understand how this squeezing of the grip affected the freedom of the motion of both wrists.

The best source of data came from a 2008 paper, "Measurement and analysis of grip force during a golf shot", by E.R.Komi, J.R Roberts and S.J Rothberg.

Good luck, and good reading,

Regards,
art
 
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ekennedy

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The last time I checked, this website is called brianmanzella.com. The man's name is in the title. After 1900 posts, you should know that by now. He is a PGA Professional and in the business of marketing himself and his teaching methods. He is also very good at his job. If you don't agree with everything he teaches, fine. Please stop ruining this site for the rest of us. Brian's not God, but he's a damn good golf professional.

If I wanted to know how to hit a golf ball using a clamp, or the practical significance of deceleration versus negative accelaration I would have clicked on shitnobodycaresabout.com.

Seriously man, find a way to use all of that knowledge you've attained, become legendary. Until then, focus on breaking 80.
 
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