D-plane

[thefuture37]

The point is that most teachers dont know..... i guess some ppl like to know what kind of meds their doctors are giving them when they're sick and maybe why... but thats just me....

Nope, doesn't make sense. Asking your doctor why he is giving you a particular medication would be analagous to asking your golf instructor why he is changing a particular part of your mechanics(i.e. I'm prescribing Norvasc for you; patient says why; doctor says because you have high blood pressure and it will lower it)

The patient doesn't need to know HOW the med works, just that it works for his problem. The golf pupil doesn't need to know HOW the swing change works, just that it will fix his swing problem. The golf student asking about the D-plane would be like a patient asking about the mechanism of drug action(most doctors wouldn't know how most drugs actually work just like most golf teachers probably dont know about this d plane).

So unless you are teaching, you don't need to know the specifics of the d-plane.

Maybe some ppl like to see doctors who prescribe meds based on trial and error? Your heart is hurting.... maybe some Advil will help

Golf isn't life and death. Some medications are prescribed by trial and error, because not everyone responds to every drug the same. It also allows the safest drug(which might not be the most effective for everyone) to be used. Similar to how an instructor might try to fix your hook with subtle changes before completely blowing up your action.

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

why does it matter if you know "why"(unless you are a teacher) if people figure it out through practice anyways? good players could hit all the shots before anyone had ever heard of the d plane. trial and error has been around forever.

You restating my point..pecky said by instinct which i feel isn't correct. No one knows by instinct, they learn it from practice even if they don't know the "why" behind it.

I didn't until this year and could hit punch shots because i learned through practice how not to let it go left

 

[thefuture37]

You restating my point..pecky said by instinct which i feel isn't correct. No one knows by instinct, they learn it from practice even if they don't know the "why" behind it.

agreed

I didn't until this year and could hit punch shots because i learned through practice how not to let it go left

are you any better at hitting them now with your new knowledge? would you have done something different to fix them hooking than moving your ball position around(like you mentioned in another post)?

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

Well even though i "know now" that doesn't mean i'm going to remember on the course everytime which is what happened the last time i played.

I could have also just opened my plane line to do the same as well and not moved the ball at all

 

[strataboy-Gary Ho]

The only reason the ball "curved off the face" of the plane I drew in the Snead/Augusta mock-up, as because I didn't draw the plane big enough.

If you have very little loft and a level-ish strike, the D-Plane would be very horizontal to the ground.

Remember!

The ball starts and curves on the D-PLane UNTIL lift and gravity effect the ball.

Brian,

As the ball spins, the dimples on the ball creates lift.... as per Mandarins spin diagram, the axis of rotation determines the curvature of the ball. So, if the D-plane only applies BEFORE LIFT affects the ball:

1.) D-plane only applies to the very very initial flight, before the ball starts spinning??
2.) D-plane would not apply to the curvature of the ball, since if there is curvature, there would be lift?
3.) Any adjustment need for flyer lies since spin properties are altered?
4.) How do you determine the curvature and remaining ball flight?

Thanks!

 

[mrose]

It all makes a lot of sense. There was a course in my area growing up where the 16th hole was a tight par 4 with cliffs and water down the entire right side. That drive used to get to me because I only played it once a year in pennant match-play for my club. I came to that hole and each time I'd just try and trap a low driver but would end up hitting a kind of bunted draw/hook down the left side. Didn't get in too much trouble but it annoyed me that I couldn't pull off the shot. At the time I thought I had been weak and cowardly and not taken the shot on but in reality due to trying to knock it down (and increasing shaft lean) my swing path was probably going straight at the water. I thought I didn't have the courage to swing far enough right when really the opposite was true. I would have had way too much forward lean and a swing path that was dramatically different to my clubface.

This type of knowledge really would be like gold in crunch situations where you really need to dial in a particular shot and NOT hit it to one side or the other. Under pressure I've always tended to try and hit it lower and more controlled but this is probably the opposite of what would be reliable. Quite some time ago I did start hitting punch shots with an open face though. I thought this was an individual quirk I had developed!!

 

[CarlSpackler]

Lets say you have 5° of forward lean (Tour average is 3° on a iron shot).

5 iron with a 10 yard cut, starting it at the center of the green, to a pin 10 yards to the right.

You'd have to SWING (not necessarily aim) ~15 yards to the left, and have a square %
5° open clubface to your swing line (plane line) just to hit it straight at the target.

So to hit a 5 iron with a 10 yard cut, starting it at the center of the green, to a pin 10 yards to the right, you'd have to have the face pointing about 15 yards to the left of the target, and make a swing (not necessarily aim) about 30 yards to the left.

(I think I have the math about right...)

Did you have to make an assumption how far he hits a 5-iron in order to do the above math?

I.E. Do you still have to make a swing 30 yards to the left if he hits a full 5-iron 75 yards?

 

[mandrin]

Brian,

As the ball spins, the dimples on the ball creates lift.... as per Mandarins spin diagram, the axis of rotation determines the curvature of the ball. So, if the D-plane only applies BEFORE LIFT affects the ball:

1.) D-plane only applies to the very very initial flight, before the ball starts spinning??
2.) D-plane would not apply to the curvature of the ball, since if there is curvature, there would be lift?
3.) Any adjustment need for flyer lies since spin properties are altered?
4.) How do you determine the curvature and remaining ball flight?

Thanks!

strataboy,

Brian is not responding to your questioning so I hope you will accept my comments.

"D-plane only applies to the very very initial flight, before the ball starts spinning??"

Spin is immediately created during impact. Hence it is the spinning ball trajectory which is contained in the D-plane.

D-plane would not apply to the curvature of the ball, since if there is curvature, there would be lift?"

Don't get the question.

"Any adjustment need for flyer lies since spin properties are altered?"

No change in the orientation of D-plane.

"How do you determine the curvature and remaining ball flight?"

Derivation of 3D ball trajectory is complex and involves non-linear parameters. However, the face normal and club head velocity vectors, defining the D-plane, determine to a large degree the initial ball trajectory after impact. Gravity force component perpendicular to D-plane and cross winds will gradually force the ball trajectory out of the D-plane.