The Release w/Brian Manzella & Michael Jacobs

[Lifter]

Bad Feels / Good Feels

THIS THREAD IS NOT AN INSTRUCTION ARTICLE.

THE VIDEOS ARE NOT INSTRUCTIONAL VIDEOS.

I am working on a new video and MJ is as well.

Well, Brian, as you can see, you've done an excellent job of whetting all our appetites. Heck, if you leave me hanging here much longer, I might get the shakes!

 

[jbrunk]

THIS THREAD IS NOT AN INSTRUCTION ARTICLE.

THE VIDEOS ARE NOT INSTRUCTIONAL VIDEOS.

I am working on a new video and MJ is as well.

I can't wait for that to come out. I think it will work perfectly for someone like me.

 

[conkanen]

THIS THREAD IS NOT AN INSTRUCTION ARTICLE.

THE VIDEOS ARE NOT INSTRUCTIONAL VIDEOS.

I am working on a new video and MJ is as well.

Can't frickin wait!

 

[mew09]

My effort at hands low to up and in at impact.

 

[Dariusz J.]

Jorgensens' book, page no,23, Experiment II drawing - explains scientifically everything that is being said here and why the concept is so crucial for everyday golfer.
The notion of squaring the face via pivot only is false becaulse we're bipeds and the necessary linear shift must happen that 'delays' the unintentional effect of the torque. One has two options to choose - either limit the linear part (which reduces the dynamism of the motion) or apply conscious action (crossover release). Both are crappy solutions. The only one possibility of automating is applying a good pivot that ensures what Brian and Michael say in the thread (vide Jorgensen's explanation). Add the info from anatomy sector about elbow joint's RoM - and everything is CLEAR.

As I told many times before - golf instruction sucked and still sucks because of some rubbish cults and lack of power of scientific researches.

Cheers

 

[dbl]

Darisuz, I reread that section now through p28, and there is some good stuff there, stuff I can use. But I'm not sure what you imply about the pivot re the relation to the elbow. Can you explain further?

 

[scorekeeper]

One of my favorite instructional titles...

NICE ANSWER LINDSEY....BUT..WHAT DID JONES SAY..."BEGINS" THE DOWNSWING...... eg. what..moves first.....DIRECTION IS THERE....BUT 'HOW"

thankx

 

[scorekeeper]

THIS THREAD IS NOT AN INSTRUCTION ARTICLE.

THE VIDEOS ARE NOT INSTRUCTIONAL VIDEOS.

I am working on a new video and MJ is as well.

well i know i am a bit different...BUT....bm...............EVERYTHING ON THIS SITE IS INSTRUCTIONAL TO ME

 

[hp12c]

Wild Bill, nice, I dont know what shot he was trying to produce in this photo array, but that looks like a flip to me.

 

[Dariusz J.]

Wild Bill, nice, I dont know what shot he was trying to produce in this photo array, but that looks like a flip to me.

In response to your previous post that I forgot to comment earlier as well as this one (I apologize) - IMO there is a crucial difference between "flip" and slap-hinge release a'la Mehlhorn. "Flip" symbolizes an error as e.g. hitting the turf before contact with the ball, a well-timed release is not an error. It's a high time to correct the instructional false reality - the ball does not care if the wrist hinges after contact and it is not an error in any case. Read also what MGJordan wrote about Wild Bill's recommendations.

Darisuz, I reread that section now through p28, and there is some good stuff there, stuff I can use. But I'm not sure what you imply about the pivot re the relation to the elbow. Can you explain further?

As mentioned before in the section of the thread devoted to the straightened/non-straightened lead arm the whole arm rotates more/less depending on the extension/flexion of the joint. In case of slightly flexed elbow joint the forearm rotates only and it can have exactly the role of the wooden stick in Jorgensen's example - ergo: not any problems with squaring up the clubface unintentionally with a properly executed pivot.

Cheers

 

[lia41985]

This guy does it well: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7BREaOsuAA

The carry and free release are beautiful.

Here you can see the wide to wider/tangential motion: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3m5yHY0ryU

 

[ms1170]

That's Noh. He looks like he's gonna be a good one.

 

[lia41985]

Tiger knew:

"When I get the club out in front of me just by speeding up my arms and slowing down my body, I hit good shots."

"A lot of it is the takeaway and making sure I've got enough width and room coming down," Woods explains.

Tiger underwent major swing reconstruction - Golf - ESPN

 

[hp12c]

Is there an agreed definition on what a flip is? your definition is not what I was taught what a flip is and has nothing to do wether one strkes the ground or ball first. One can strike the ground first with any type of release, swing, motion and is an error unless the golfer was intending to do that,if not then its called hitting it fat, laying sod over it, and my all time favorite chunky monkee. I was taught not to bend the left wrist at and through impact, how far after impact is somewhat a gray area, but definitely no left wrist breakdown, what Im starting to see and read currently is bending the left wrist aka slap hinge release is ok, where before it was a no no due to the imperative of no left wrist breakdown. I ask the forum members, the moderators, instructors and of course Bmanz, what is the consensus on what a flip is.

 

[Brian Manzella]

From the new Confessions of a Former Flipper 2 (Son of a Flipper — Handle Draggers Anonymous edition) video working script:

What is a flip?

Basically, the wrist movement that creates an unintentional BACKWARD lean of the hosel at or before impact.

Period.

 

[hp12c]

From the new Confessions of a Former Flipper 2 (Son of a Flipper — Handle Draggers Anonymous edition) video working script:

What is a flip?

Basically, the wrist movement that creates an unintentional BACKWARD lean of the hosel at or before impact.


Period.

From what I understand from your definition a backward leaning of the hosel after impact would not be a flip? One more question why did you say hosel and not hosel and shaft?

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

From what I understand from your definition a backward leaning of the hosel after impact would not be a flip? One more question why did you say hosel and not hosel and shaft?

I'm guessing because it has to relate to the loft delivered at impact and that is really only measurable from the hosel since the shaft is acting like a string.

 

[Dariusz J.]

Is there an agreed definition on what a flip is? your definition is not what I was taught what a flip is and has nothing to do wether one strkes the ground or ball first. One can strike the ground first with any type of release, swing, motion and is an error unless the golfer was intending to do that,if not then its called hitting it fat, laying sod over it, and my all time favorite chunky monkee. I was taught not to bend the left wrist at and through impact, how far after impact is somewhat a gray area, but definitely no left wrist breakdown, what Im starting to see and read currently is bending the left wrist aka slap hinge release is ok, where before it was a no no due to the imperative of no left wrist breakdown. I ask the forum members, the moderators, instructors and of course Bmanz, what is the consensus on what a flip is.

Well, you asked I answered what I thought (although Brian's definition is much better, I agree). And the fact that you were taught that slap-hinge release is not a valid method of releasing is irrevelant. Simply the source you had this information is wrong and outdated. This type of release were OK in Vardon/Mehlhorn times, then Henry Cotton later classified it as one of three release types, and now true science revitalizes it while putting junk instruction to the trash bin, thanks God.

Cheers

 

[Brian Manzella]

Often the shaft is leaning backward but the hosel is still leaning forward.

 

[birly-shirly]

From the new Confessions of a Former Flipper 2 (Son of a Flipper — Handle Draggers Anonymous edition) video working script:

What is a flip?

Basically, the wrist movement that creates an unintentional BACKWARD lean of the hosel at or before impact.

Period.

Is COFF2 necessary? Reading this thread, I'd have thought "Confessions of a Former COFF-er" would be more apt...

Besides, I thought (and accept, BTW) that teaching people to square the face properly more or less did away with any flipping.