A controversial subject
- Thread starter Ringer
- Start date
- Status
What do you THINK I mean Lynn?
Stop avoiding the question of FORCE of where, and why, force is directed at the aiming point, and where that aiming point ideally should be. Of where the center of the rotational force is, not of the club Lynn.
Support your point. Let's hear it. Why is both arms straight such a key position Lynn? What is 'it' that you are either pushing or pulling Lynn? Use the picture on the top of the page if you need a reference, because what "I" am talking about is EXACTLY that (and if there were the next 'frame', the club would again line up with center).
Stop avoiding the question of FORCE of where, and why, force is directed at the aiming point, and where that aiming point ideally should be. Of where the center of the rotational force is, not of the club Lynn.
Support your point. Let's hear it. Why is both arms straight such a key position Lynn? What is 'it' that you are either pushing or pulling Lynn? Use the picture on the top of the page if you need a reference, because what "I" am talking about is EXACTLY that (and if there were the next 'frame', the club would again line up with center).
bcoak
New
EdZ,
Doesn't it strike you as odd that you are the only one that believes what you are saying? People have refuted you at every turn, yet "we" are the ones that don't understand and "we" are wrong and don't "get it."
You can stomp and cry and re-state all you want, but you have been proven wrong at every turn, in a civilized manner for the most part I might add and which you did not afford others, yet you continue.
Brian, can we lock this folder and blow it up and get back to the great practical stuff that you and others have been trying to teach?
Doesn't it strike you as odd that you are the only one that believes what you are saying? People have refuted you at every turn, yet "we" are the ones that don't understand and "we" are wrong and don't "get it."
You can stomp and cry and re-state all you want, but you have been proven wrong at every turn, in a civilized manner for the most part I might add and which you did not afford others, yet you continue.
Brian, can we lock this folder and blow it up and get back to the great practical stuff that you and others have been trying to teach?
this thread is like watching Trash TV.
Edz,
there's a couple of mistakes you made. I would like you to listen and learn from this, but this is your choice. You have the right to ack as smart or stupid as you want.
First, you made an "absolutistic" statement on the nonexistence of God. Whether or not a supreme being exists, your comment shows ignorance and lack of emotional maturity (maybe only in this instance).
Second, you suggest an "if you don't like it, then don't read it" solution to the complaints about your posts. This is not effective. Why?...late me get back to this later...
Edz,
there's a couple of mistakes you made. I would like you to listen and learn from this, but this is your choice. You have the right to ack as smart or stupid as you want.
First, you made an "absolutistic" statement on the nonexistence of God. Whether or not a supreme being exists, your comment shows ignorance and lack of emotional maturity (maybe only in this instance).
Second, you suggest an "if you don't like it, then don't read it" solution to the complaints about your posts. This is not effective. Why?...late me get back to this later...
If I am wrong, than Brian is as well. LOOK AT THE PICTURE
I have perhaps not used all the proper TGM terms, but I am not, nor have I ever claimed to be, a TGM guru.
I haven't been proven wrong at all, I am STILL waiting to get ANYONE to respond to the quesion posed about ROTATIONAL FORCE. Yet a small number of people continue to attack me, and not my argument, nor prove their position.
If my view really is that wrong, prove it. Use the picture at the top of this page. Honestly, if you can list reasonable points to support your position, I will gladly LEARN. Yet not one of you is countering my position with anything other than attack.
Turfspanker
New
A hand from the back of the room.
Ed - It's your old buddy Spanker. Now I promise I won't post again on this thread and God I hate engaging on this but I want to make sure I understand your position, as it has come up many times before in this forum, it would be really nice to conclude it.
Your position is that there is an invisible connection between the center point of the swing, "rotation point" which is located at the base of the back of the neck, and Pressure Point #1 where the hands meet. That connection is maintained throughout the swing and realizes it's greatest arc or length at both arms straight. The "force" is clubhead lag and you are aiming that force at the both arms straight location. The force is maintained by the all of the appropriate pressure points during the swing rotation, but primarily #1 and #4 stay active all the way to the aiming point. What did I miss? Oh the Flail. The flail is not the left arm and shoulder, but the invisible line of connection between the rotation point and the hands. Did I get the EdZ interpretation absolutely correct. If not, could you CLEARLY state your thesis? If this is correct, could you please identify for us unenlightened TGM folks, where we can reference this in the TGM Bible?
Thanks,
Spanker
Ed - It's your old buddy Spanker. Now I promise I won't post again on this thread and God I hate engaging on this but I want to make sure I understand your position, as it has come up many times before in this forum, it would be really nice to conclude it.
Your position is that there is an invisible connection between the center point of the swing, "rotation point" which is located at the base of the back of the neck, and Pressure Point #1 where the hands meet. That connection is maintained throughout the swing and realizes it's greatest arc or length at both arms straight. The "force" is clubhead lag and you are aiming that force at the both arms straight location. The force is maintained by the all of the appropriate pressure points during the swing rotation, but primarily #1 and #4 stay active all the way to the aiming point. What did I miss? Oh the Flail. The flail is not the left arm and shoulder, but the invisible line of connection between the rotation point and the hands. Did I get the EdZ interpretation absolutely correct. If not, could you CLEARLY state your thesis? If this is correct, could you please identify for us unenlightened TGM folks, where we can reference this in the TGM Bible?
Thanks,
Spanker
quote:Originally posted by holenone
Hmmm...you are asking what I think about what you mean when you say what you do.
And I thought financial derivatives were hard. This is a Close Encounter of the Third Kind!
Interesting, now I am apparently an alien. Still not answering the question Lynn....... support YOUR view, don't accept mine. Convince me, I'd love to learn. Use the picture at the top of the page Lynn.
Ed,
-- Both Arms Straight is a key position because Homer said it was.
-- You are Pushing and Pulling against the Clubhead's disinclination to go along with you, i.e., the Clubhead Lag. At least that's what Homer says. And, as you have pointed out, what Homer says 'goes' with me.
-- And I don't need to reference the picture because I have the ones of the lady in Homer's book. For the point being illustrated, they are correct. I know that 'cause Homer said so.
Any other questions?
A fairly accurate summary. Some points of clarification:
1) the "rotation point" is at both arms straight and is basically located near PP1, not at the center, as you stated. The term refers to a swinger motion, that is the point where the arms/hands rotate around at/after both arms straight. The alternative would be the 'mirror point', for a hitter, in which the wrists would bend/arch rather than rotate or 'swivel'. See EdZ drill #2, fingers interlocked, the point near your wedding ring is the 'rotation point'.
2) the connection between the center point, and PP1 remain on the same plane, as drawn at address, but not the same distance, neccessarily (ideally both as straight a line, and as long a line as possible however). This is one and the same as the turned shoulder plane (as I understand it), but is clearer to see during the entire motion. If you draw a line from the butt of the club, along the underside of the upper arms, to the mid point between the shoulders at address, you would see the basic 'plane' I am talking about (it is slightly higher, through the arm, but you see the idea)
3) pressure points stay active as long as possible, but all are released by both arms straight, by definition
The two drills of mine illustrate these points if you would like a reference.
And finally - isn't everything in TGM? I'll let mr. hole explain what homer said.
bcoak
New
Edz: "the connection between the center point, and PP1 remain on the same plane, as drawn at address, but not the same distance, neccessarily (ideally both as straight a line, and as long a line as possible however). This is one and the same as the turned shoulder plane (as I understand it), but is clearer to see during the entire motion. If you draw a line from the butt of the club, along the underside of the upper arms, to the mid point between the shoulders at address, you would see the basic 'plane' I am talking about (it is slightly higher, through the arm, but you see the idea)"
So I don't get lost in translation, I thought the key plane in TGM parlance was the one set by the shaft angle at address. This is what you trace going back and then try and get on coming down with pp3. Correct?
It seems fgrom the above EdZ is talking more of the Hogan plane, from the neck? Is this correct, EdZ?
WHich one should I consider?
So I don't get lost in translation, I thought the key plane in TGM parlance was the one set by the shaft angle at address. This is what you trace going back and then try and get on coming down with pp3. Correct?
It seems fgrom the above EdZ is talking more of the Hogan plane, from the neck? Is this correct, EdZ?
WHich one should I consider?
- Status