Interesting question....

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drewyallop

drewyallop

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Virtuoso said:
Just remember, it's m times v, so if you want more v, then train with big m. Don't do the silly "speed drills" with light objects. That's not going to help you a bit at 105 mph.

BTW, just wait til you get some back fat. I got mine when I turned 42.
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You may have this wrong virt. mv is momentum but what you want is more kinetic energy delivered to the ball. Kinetic energy is 1/2mv^2 so the energy delivered is not linear with velocity, it is exponential. So if you have a choice of swinging more mass or swinging faster, the latter is going to produce more distance, inter alia. This is why smaller caliber bullets have become common in service weapons. Mass is decreased and velocity is increased resulting in a much higher kinetic energy being delivered to the body of the poor soul receiving it.

Did you mean fat back? Praise the lard!
 
R

ryant91

New
Virtuoso said:
Don't let anyone make you work on short game or consistency if that is not what makes the game fun. If being a bomber is what floats your boat, then become a bomber. Speaking as a guy that use to swing around 117, nothing is more fun than out-driving your buddies by 75 yards. I love watching them try to wail on their next drive just to reduce the embarrasment, and start throwing out neck weasels.

Another fun thing to do, is watch them hit a good one, and then say, "Wow, you tore the cover off that thing"....and then out drive them by 80.

Just remember, it's m times v, so if you want more v, then train with big m. Don't do the silly "speed drills" with light objects. That's not going to help you a bit at 105 mph.

BTW, just wait til you get some back fat. I got mine when I turned 42.
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Silly speed drills? May want to rethink that. Your dead wrong
 
B

Brian Manzella

Administrator
There is this little thing called technique, you know.

For example, this little note from a student of mine who has implemented negative alpha with great effectiveness:


"123.5 club head speed with 184 ball speed. Carry: 317 carry, total 356. Tiny left to right wind, not helping, maybe hurting a touch.

2.0 yards left of target.

My longest (trackman) drive ever, and I had about 12 in a row over 120 none more than 20 yards left, ZERO RIGHT OF TARGET!!!!!

Had a witness too. Lol. "
​
 
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spktho

New
Brian Manzella said:
There is this little thing called technique, you know.

For example, this little note from a student of mine who has implemented negative alpha with great effectiveness:


"123.5 club head speed with 184 ball speed. Carry: 317 carry, total 356. Tiny left to right wind, not helping, maybe hurting a touch.

2.0 yards left of target.

My longest (trackman) drive ever, and I had about 12 in a row over 120 none more than 20 yards left, ZERO RIGHT OF TARGET!!!!!

Had a witness too. Lol. "
​
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What was his clubhead speed prior?
 
L

Lifter

New
spktho said:
Really?

Start here:

http://www.brianmanzella.com/golfin...e-golf-com-front9-tigers-hand-move-irons.html
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Thanks spktho! I also found this:

<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/39031201" width="500" height="375" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe> <p><a href="http://vimeo.com/39031201">Where's The Torque?</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user1093431">Brian Manzella</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>
 
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spktho

New
Brian Manzella said:
The most instructive thing on this website in the last 5 years is Lifter asking what is negative torque?....
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Unfortunately (maybe fortunately) with all the "how to get more lag" and "flat left wrist" and "square through impact" advice, the negative alpha torque is very instructive.
 
Virtuoso

Virtuoso

New
drewyallop said:
You may have this wrong virt. mv is momentum but what you want is more kinetic energy delivered to the ball. Kinetic energy is 1/2mv^2 so the energy delivered is not linear with velocity, it is exponential. So if you have a choice of swinging more mass or swinging faster, the latter is going to produce more distance, inter alia. This is why smaller caliber bullets have become common in service weapons. Mass is decreased and velocity is increased resulting in a much higher kinetic energy being delivered to the body of the poor soul receiving it.
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yeah, Drew, I got all that. That's not what I meant.

What I meant was, if Lifter wants to train for more speed, he should work out with heavy weights or heavy resistence, not train with light stuff. So, if he learns how to move heavy stuff fast, when he goes to the actual lighter club, it will move a lot faster. That is how you make the biggest gain in clubhead speed.
 
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Lifter

New
Virtuoso said:
yeah, Drew, I got all that. That's not what I meant.

What I meant was, if Lifter wants to train for more speed, he should work out with heavy weights or heavy resistence, not train with light stuff. So, if he learns how to move heavy stuff fast, when he goes to the actual lighter club, it will move a lot faster. That is how you make the biggest gain in clubhead speed.
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Can weight training really result in substantially higher clubhead speed?
 
L

Lifter

New
Lifter said:
Thinking more about "quick" vs. "fast"......I personally see the main distinction as "big and strong" vs. "flexible." I would imagine that some baseball pitchers mostly rely on their size and strength. Other pitchers, meanwhile, might use a very different technique that relies on their flexibility.

In golf, think of Michelle Wie: flexible vs. Laura Davies: big and strong?
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And I still haven't heard anyone opine on Michelle Wie vs. Laura Davies.......
 
Virtuoso

Virtuoso

New
Lifter said:
Can weight training really result in substantially higher clubhead speed?
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Yes, if you make the muscles bigger that, in your golf orientation, create anglular acceleration of the lead arm at the beginning of the downswing, you will create substantially higher clubhead speed. You need to already have good technique and sequence in place.

Which muscles those are is a long conversation, but if you have the right training contraption, you don't need to know what they are.
 
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Bigwill

New
Lifter said:
Can weight training really result in substantially higher clubhead speed?
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Just look at the long drive circuit. If nothing else changes (flexibility, technique, etc.), wouldn't stronger muscles result in more force production, hence more speed?

I look at it like this: You can swing a lighter club faster, right? So, all things remaining equal, weight training should effectively lighten the club in relation to your strength level.

Maybe the nature of how the strength is gained is overrated. There have been bodybuilders and former bodybuilders who are very long, and the type of training that they do is not what would be recommended for speed production. But the fact is that their muscles are stronger, and that increased strength, even if trained below the threshold of what would be considered explosive, contributed to a high clubhead speed.
 
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B

Bigwill

New
Virtuoso said:
Yes, if you make the muscles bigger that, in your golf orientation, create anglular acceleration of the lead arm at the beginning of the downswing, you will create substantially higher clubhead speed. You need to already have good technique and sequence in place.

Which muscles those are is a long conversation, but if you have the right training contraption, you don't need to know what they are.
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I've always wondered if this level of specificity was necessary to gain a benefit from increased strength. If you were to follow a comprehensive strengthening program, wouldn't the act of swinging the club take care of the neurological aspect of translating that strength over to the golf swing?
 
Virtuoso

Virtuoso

New
Bigwill said:
I've always wondered if this level of specificity was necessary to gain a benefit from increased strength. If you were to follow a comprehensive strengthening program, wouldn't the act of swinging the club take care of the neurological aspect of translating that strength over to the golf swing?
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That's my opinion. You can't just make the muscles stronger, you have to make them stronger by making them do a larger amount of work in the exact specfic orientation and action they would follow in the swing.

So, if you had a contraption that let you start the 1st phase of the downswing, while holding on to a grip, with your normal grip, and you could increase the resistence dramatically......wow, huge gains. It can't just be a heavy club. It has to be some rubberband thingy and adjustable so that you could change settings and increase resistence as your muscles grow.

Then you go back to a normal club, normal weight, and the velocity goes way up.
 
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