Accumulator #3

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shootin4par

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I think I fully understand this accumalator now. For those who thnk the angle is the accumalator, what If the left forarm did not rotate then wouldn't that zero out accumalator #3. SO a horizontal hinge would have ZERO, an angled would be in the middle, and a vertical hinge would have the most accumulation. there is a reason why homer said do the drills now isnt there. Brian, how did I do on this one? Of course I had a little help though;)
 
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6bee1dee

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quote:Originally posted by shootin4par

Thanks RWH and I guess that settles the confusion.

Acummalator number three is ROTATION OF LEFT FOREARM> No ties, geek!!! So why no ties, well play connect the dots. Homer Wrote the book and Doyle was taught by HOMER HIMSELF, Bman was taught by Doyle and with only two links in a chain there is not much room for recnfiguration.
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Lynn Blake was taught by Homer, too. Lynn, Doyle and Manzella is a team to believe in.
 
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MizunoJoe

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quote:Originally posted by shootin4par

I think I fully understand this accumalator now. For those who thnk the angle is the accumalator, what If the left forarm did not rotate then wouldn't that zero out accumalator #3.
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You clearly don't. #3 accum IS the angle between the left arm and the shaft at address. Moreover it's unloading in a Swing, called Throwout, has nothing to do with intentional left arm rotation. It's produced by CF via shoulder rotation. The more #3, the more open the shoulders are at impact than they were at address. Step through impact in the Swing below to see this. Notice in the frame just past impact how the inside of his left arm is still slightly facing downward - no full left arm roll.

http://homepage.mac.com/brianmanzella/.Movies/bartlett3.mov
 
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MizunoJoe

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Bono wrote,

"The term drive out does not imply use of accumulator #3, but rather - right arm thrust (not accumulator #3)."

Then why does HK list the stroke variation of the Basic Hitting pattern(12-1-0), to be Triple Barrel(1/2/3)?
 
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MizunoJoe

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quote:Originally posted by David Alford

Are you serious? I didn't say the left arm detaches from the socket!

But, if you want to keep the left arm in CONTACT with the chest, just bring it close to rt. pocket on the downswing so your left elbow stays in contact. Let us know if you can find your ball.
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Did you not step through Players Swing? [:0] His inert left arm is plastered against his chest by the rotating shoulders and blasts into impact. Player found his ball.
 
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Bono

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quote:Originally posted by MizunoJoe

Bono wrote,

"The term drive out does not imply use of accumulator #3, but rather - right arm thrust (not accumulator #3)."

Then why does HK list the stroke variation of the Basic Hitting pattern(12-1-0), to be Triple Barrel(1/2/3)?
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MJ,
I dont have the book here - in the middle of a move.

But - a hitter isnt necessarily dismissing #3 accumulator, but drive out, his is driving is right forearm, hand, pressure point 1. And because of the way a hitter would generally load it, that thrust direction would be 'out to right field'. This impacts the full use of accumulator #3...it kind of lessens it.

Make sense?

Think about it - appears everyone agreed that, in some shape or form, accumulator #3 results in roll - and if the thrust direction is crossline, then how could full roll occur?
 
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MizunoJoe

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"This impacts the full use of accumulator #3...it kind of lessens it.

Make sense?"

No.

"Think about it - appears everyone agreed that, in some shape or form, accumulator #3 results in roll - and if the thrust direction is crossline, then how could full roll occur?"

I didn't, because Throwout(Driveout) is not left arm roll - see my other posts above. Also look at Couples in this link. He has ZERO left arm roll, but this is a 4/3/2 Swing with Throwout.

http://www.golfdigest.com/instructi...instruction/swingsequences/gd1996couples.html
 
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David Alford

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MJ, I guess the solution is to define "arm", "chest" and "close contact". A priori, if someone says their arm is plastered to the chest, what comes to my mind is the proximity you would have in a chip shot. A perfect example of how differing frames of reference cause confusion.
 
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Bono

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quote:Originally posted by MizunoJoe

"This impacts the full use of accumulator #3...it kind of lessens it.

Make sense?"

No.

"Think about it - appears everyone agreed that, in some shape or form, accumulator #3 results in roll - and if the thrust direction is crossline, then how could full roll occur?"

I didn't, because Throwout(Driveout) is not left arm roll - see my other posts above. Also look at Couples in this link. He has ZERO left arm roll, but this is a 4/3/2 Swing with Throwout.

http://www.golfdigest.com/instructi...instruction/swingsequences/gd1996couples.html
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MJ...

A few things - throwout and driveout are not the same. Again, throwout refers to centrifugal force, drive out to right arm thrust.

In hitting, right arm thrust is crossline, in swinging, centrifugal force is rotational obviously. The resulting roll is not the same - hence the difference in angled and horizontal hinging to a degree - they all tie in together. If a hitter horizontal hinges - he is manipulating the club to a degree (not saying it cant be done, hasnt been done, etc).

I cannot access the link - but Couples has strong double action - if he rolled, he can say goodbye to the PGA tour and hello to the woods on the left.
 
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MizunoJoe

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Bono - then what power mechanism is this "Driveout"? It's not wristcock, not right elbow, and not #4 Accum. You say it's not #3 Accum unloading, so nothing's left. Are you saying HK missed something? Again - whether or not you have the book in front of you, HK lists the basic Hitting motion as using Accums 1/2/3. So if Driveout doesn't effect #3 Accum, what does and how?
 
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Bono

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quote:Originally posted by MizunoJoe

Bono - then what power mechanism is this "Driveout"? It's not wristcock, not right elbow, and not #4 Accum. You say it's not #3 Accum unloading, so nothing's left. Are you saying HK missed something? Again - whether or not you have the book in front of you, HK lists the basic Hitting motion as using Accums 1/2/3. So if Driveout doesn't effect #3 Accum, what does and how?
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MJ,
Sorry, I am not being clear.

Driveout is a reference to the right forearm, the driving right forearm, which is generally the primary power source in hitting.

Basic hitting motion of 1/2/3 make sense to me - accumulator #3 isnt negated or zeroed out and accumulator #1 is usually the primary power source, powered by the right triceps.

If you are up and want to discuss, pm me on Lynn's forum and I'll shoot you my number.
 
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MizunoJoe

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quote:Originally posted by brianman

Joe...Tom Bartlett CLEARLY rolls his left hand through impact.
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It goes from turned to vertical past impact because of CF. Look at the video, when the clubhead is 12" past impact the inside of the left forearm is still facing somewhat downward and you can see the inside of the right forearm.
 
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MizunoJoe

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"Basic hitting motion of 1/2/3 make sense to me - accumulator #3 isnt negated or zeroed out and accumulator #1 is usually the primary power source, powered by the right triceps."

If Driveout isn't unloading #3 what does?
 
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Brian Manzella

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Who said ANYTHING about what RELEASES an accumulator....you are correct that in hitting the roll will come from drive out and in swinging throwout.

That's another video.
 
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MizunoJoe

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"you are correct that in hitting the roll will come from drive out and in swinging throwout."

That would be true if "the roll" is replaced by "#3 Accum power".
 
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MizunoJoe

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quote:Originally posted by brianman

Joe...simple question....how else could I have moved that ball with #3 only?
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You moved the ball by rotating the left arm, not by using #3 properly, which is done by CF in a Swing. That's the only way to "fake it", if you don't rotate your shoulders.

When you zeroed out #3, you illustrated the falacious A J Bonar concept that assumes the clubhead is a little baseball bat attached to the shaft and that the sweetspot rotates around the hosel.
 
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